Is GW starting to loose it a bit?
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Author:  Azure [ Sat Jun 07, 2008 5:58 pm ]
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Games need to be based off of the bases if they are model games. Otherwise it makes it a bigger advantage to be a douche and buy every crouching scout and laying down guardsman you can find.


Author:  Dreadlord taylindril [ Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:11 pm ]
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I totaly agree, I don't belive, we should be punished for modeling our model's in heroic postions.

We just better hope their is still sensible people out their.

Author:  Vorchild [ Sat Jun 07, 2008 11:24 pm ]
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Drainial Shadowheart wrote:
Which armies are those, I can't think of any.

Dark Eldar, for one, though the S8 is lance weapons, but that still doesn't help against a monolith. I haven't looked in detail through the Ork codex, but I was told by an ork player that S8 is as high as it goes - he was the one who was doing most of the complaining - I just repeat what I hear. ;)

Author:  Darthken [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:43 pm ]
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Funny how so few here realise how crappy true LOS is.

yes i totally agree. going back to the old " i can see your arm through the window so i can shoot you"

and all my terrain is now useless as cover (being buildings and ruins with windows.)
as i play the 40k equivilent of Dark elf, the dark eldar. im not lookin foward to having virtiually no where to hide my troops without being shot at. true they'll get a cover save.
my vehicles all sit on the tradional stands which has them sitting higher than a ground vehicle so i can't hid them behind any off the hills at the club

and all armies can now "run" so whats the point of having fleet of foot now that everyone can do it

Author:  Jadin [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:25 pm ]
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Just take your vehicles off their stands, none of my Tau Devislfish/Hammerheads/Skyrays are on them. Also, people can be a tool and cut it down to the point where they are still on the base and you can hide them behind the hills at the club.

Author:  Warpix [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:06 pm ]
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darthken, I feel your pains. My original army is Eldar, so in my 1500pts tourney list, my two fire prisms are nerfed, as well as my squad of Harlequins(though they have the easier side of it I guess), the only thing I have that can capture points is two guardian squads, and a wraithguard squad(which I had to downgrade the prisms a little in order to afford a spirit seer). Though I have to admit, it is cool to have an Avatar and a bunch of Wraithguard running.

I also have a static IG army, it has six tanks in it for capturing points (two are bassies, so they normally stay stationary), but that doesn't work anymore, and all my IG platoons use heavy weapons, so they either stationary, or not shooting. That and I don't know if my tank company will stay as a GW legal list (though its constantly ruled out from tournies.)

And I have a small Dark Eldar force collecting dust, and with 5th ed, they will probably continue to do so(until GW decides to re-do their codex, but that's still a ways away).

This edition really nerfs armies that focus on non-troop units, like how Eldar take pride in their specials (I feel sorry for all the aspect warrior armies out there), or vehicles, I may pick up the rule book for 5th ed, but only reluctantly, seeing that I'm still not sure if I want to play it.

Author:  No one [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 6:20 pm ]
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running doesn't let you charge as far as i've heard and fleet does, so feet does have an advance

Author:  Izirath [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:25 pm ]
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I think 40k is crazy and just... It's just so frickin dumb, that's all I have to say. I think the rules are dumb, that everything about it is excessive and that apocalypse is crazy big. It's all so big it just goes stupid. Anyone agrees?

Author:  Heat-13 [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:29 pm ]
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I disagree with Izirath - 40k is fun, I like the SF background. What do you mean big? Most 40K armies are way smaller then most fantasy armies models wise...

But he's right - apocalypse is crazy...

Author:  Izirath [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:54 pm ]
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I mean that they are going so hard on apocalypse. Just check it out, Forgeworld, it's gargantuan. Line of sight laser pointer? omg.
And this

So many?

They're really going hard on 40k I think. And the Empire... Argh, almost every AB out there in 40k is written from the Empire's opinion. And what's with everyone hating Tau and everyone at least to have one SM army? I think it's all crazy.

Author:  Jadin [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:58 pm ]
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I like Tau and I dont have a Marine army...

Author:  Warpix [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:46 pm ]
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I don't have a Marine army, and as for hating Tau, I don't, but certain Tau players get on my nerves.

People may hate Tau for any of the following.
-They're the new army on the block
-The Hammerhead can fire a single S10 AP1 shot, or a large blast
-The Hammerhead has BS 4
-The Hammerhead costs about the same as a normal Leman Russ
-Markerlights can get annoying
-Battlesuits can be cheesy as all hell with that second jump of theirs

Or those are at least the reasons that I see why people would hate Tau, I'm not going to mention S5 weapons as a standard since I doubt too many people care too much about this.

40k is a fun game, its completely over the top, but fun. GW writes their rules with good intentions, but someone manages to break them.

I like 40k, I just don't like much of what I've heard about 5th ed, because it won't be balanced until they re-do all of the 40k codexes.

As for the green plastic counter, what's up with the cloud and moon in the lower left corner?

One thing does bother me though, GW does try to milk their customers for money. The gamers edition of 40k costs 90$, it contains a rule book(50$), templates(6$) and counters (15$). So buying it separately costs 71$ for that extra 19$, you get a metal ammo case that is lined with "egg-shell foam".

Author:  Kargan daemonclaw [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:04 pm ]
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Things must vary a lot form region to region because your experiences differ completely from mine.

Getting angry about rumours of rules about a game that hasn't been released yet seems rather crazy. Wait and read the rules when they come out and play games before getting angry about the rules.

I don't see what all the fuss is about the terrain rules. Hills are not currently area terrain they are line of sight, that isn't changing.

With things like ruins, if you are in a ruined building with significant walls, there are now places that you can hide, before you needed to be behind the building to not be shot at. If the enemy can see your models and can shoot at them you will get a cover save. No real difference to now.

In English the Empire is only used in Fantasy to descibe the pesudo medieval german human kingdom. In 40k the human empire is called the Imperium.

GW write all their 40k fiction from a human point of view and have since the start of 3rd ed at least (so the last 10 years).
They do this so that they can maintain the mystery of the alien races, unlike roleplaying sourcebooks that remove any mystery and doubt, the GW books are all supposed to add to an overall background. It's also hard to portray alien thoughts. How exciting is fluff from a tyranid POV eat, eat, eat etc. There's no character development or individuality.

You could argue that they are going really hard on LOTR becuase there is a release of the Mordor suppliment.

I think the idea of a set of game aid counters looks really useful GF( have made a business out of game aids so players will likely find a use for GW ones.

Most players have a marine army (if they have one at all) because they come in the box and make a good army for a beginner and are tactically flexible and forgiving. There is also a lot of background about them so it's easy to make up your own background or use GWs.

Everyone doesn't hate Tau. Some players dislike particular builds of Tau, but that's just the same as people disliking 2 dragon HE, 2 treeman WE or Necro bunker VC.

Author:  Darthken [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:10 am ]
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yes GW are going hard on apocalypse, lots of big box sets worth lots of dollars

no at my club plays it all. we were all wise enough to see it for what it was. a way to try and get people to buy more & more models, thus enriching GW.

the people who could afford to buy it didn't, and most parents of the younger players saw the prices and said "no way".

Just take your vehicles off their stands,

not a chance, i spent a lot of time and effort pinning those stands so my vehicles look like skimmers instead of a beached boats.

dark eldar & darkelf are a lot alike, you win with them in the movement phase, by best positioning you troops to take advantage of your opponents weaknesses. with very little armour speed is to my advantage.
but now that you can shoot your lascannon/rail gun through two windows of a building, or just shoot my vehicles because the terrain being used is not high enough.

Author:  Jadin [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 1:07 pm ]
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Yeah, I pinned the stands too, but they eventually broke.

I hate people who complain about Crisis Suits second move. All I have to say is Eldar Warp Spiders are more powerful.

Author:  Kyrel [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:34 pm ]
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Hm. So we've reached 5th ed. in 40K now. Oh well. Can't really say that I give a damned. The changeover from 2nd ed. ruined the game from my POW. But to each their own. The 40K fluff is still pretty nice though.

Author:  Warpix [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 10:36 pm ]
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Jadin wrote:
I hate people who complain about Crisis Suits second move. All I have to say is Eldar Warp Spiders are more powerful.

Warpspiders have AP - weapons and can kill themselves on their second jump.

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