New unit? Predator Knights

[Malda]

Hello

I got inspired by Darkblade novels, where Coldones are just huge, tough, pissed of and hungry... current raptors are just too small and weak, to represent this...

So I tried to write new unit - Predator Knights, representing former Dread Knight Champions taming bigger mounts. So the knight profile is exact profile of Champion of Dreadknights.

I tried to write the "Hungry" rule to represent them being almost impossible to keep them out of combat for longer time, because their need is growing.. They just need fresh meat!

Predator Knights 60 pt/model
Dread Knight Champion Predator (Tyraptor?)
M WS BS-- S-- T-- W--I---A--Ld
5-- 6-- 5-- 4-- 3-- 1-- 6-- 2-- 9
7-- 4-- 0-- 5-- 5-- 3-- 3-- 2-- 4
Monstrous Cavalery Base size: 50x75mm
Unit size 3-6

Special Rules: Hungry, Killer Habits (Knight only), Supernatural Reflexes (Knight only)
Equipment: Lance, Heavy Armour, Shield, Natural Armour
Options: None

Hungry: Frenzy (mount only). Unit suffers -1 Ld for its frenzy test for each turn without being in combat. Never overruns.

No standart: They would ever carry only army battle standart
No champions: They already are champions, bigger than them are heroes.
No musicans: You have no time to play music when riding Predator.

They could be represented for example by gamezone models, they are pretty big...

Name predator is inspired by gamezone mini, but could be changed to something else, like Tyraptor, or any other cooler name

Would you like to have such unit in new book? Would you modify it somehow?

[Vulcan]

Do we really need this?

[Red...]

It's a fun idea with some elements of interest. Are you aiming for 8th ed or Age of S[hit]mar?

You mention the rules "Killer Habits" and "Supernatural Reflexes" but don't explain what these do. Maybe you could clarify those?

[Malda]

Do we really need this?

Well, it depends how you look at it...


From game perspective:

I think our heavy cavalery is even after drop to 26points still quite uninteresting. I think they still need some serious reconsideration and change. Coldones werent used because they were too expensive, but because they are slow, unreliable and still pretty fragile... they are element, you dont want to have in your army... Only as an "Deathstar".

Idally, I would prefer them to replace our current cavalery... It would fit better our "monster" theme and it would be an interesting way to differ us from other armies, having no regular heavy cavalery, only medium cavalery and monsters / monster cav...

then my answer is YES, we need big change for coldone knights, and this one could be good...


From model / fluff perspective:

They would just look cool ...and i need my army to be cool, so my answer is yes

[Malda]

It's a fun idea with some elements of interest. Are you aiming for 8th ed or Age of S[hit]mar?

You mention the rules "Killer Habits" and "Supernatural Reflexes" but don't explain what these do. Maybe you could clarify those?

no, its aimed at 9th age, the rules are there: http://www.the-ninth-age.com/index.php?simple-page/

[Daeron]

Personally, I would love to see Cold One Knights to be upgraded to monstrous cavalry or something equivalent. It would seem fitting, considering how they are described in the fluff. Following the fluff, they could easily be twice the size they are now.
But I'm not sure if it's the best path to choose from a gaming perspective. It might also upset the balance. We have elite infantry, heavy casters, fast cav, decent shooting, monsters. Throw monstrous cavalry in there and there's little we won't have.

But yeah, I would still love to see COKs upgraded to monstrous cav. The rules you suggest seem okay, but I'd replace the Hungry with Frenzy simply to reuse the existing rules as much as possible. I'd make the monsters WS3 (I mean, that's still the level of a trained soldier) and give them devastating charge.
T6 is nice, but 2W and 2+ AS doesn't make them very resilient. So they still fit the glass cannon concept.
I'd drop the WS 6 to WS 5, since WS6 should be limited to characters and high elves with an ice cube syndrome.

Point wise, that seems like a good starting point to start testing.

[Malda]

Personally, I would love to see Cold One Knights to be upgraded to monstrous cavalry or something equivalent. It would seem fitting, considering how they are described in the fluff. Following the fluff, they could easily be twice the size they are now.
But I'm not sure if it's the best path to choose from a gaming perspective. It might also upset the balance. We have elite infantry, heavy casters, fast cav, decent shooting, monsters. Throw monstrous cavalry in there and there's little we won't have.

yes, but everything except monsters is so fragile... well, that implies, knights should be fragile too, or rare and expensive...

But yeah, I would still love to see COKs upgraded to monstrous cav. The rules you suggest seem okay, but I'd replace the Hungry with Frenzy simply to reuse the existing rules as much as possible.

That might work, for the siplification of things, with fluff explanation... one thing I miss about it is the fact, that when they wipe somenone out, they should just stay at the place and feed...

I'd make the monsters WS3 (I mean, that's still the level of a trained soldier) and give them devastating charge.
T6 is nice, but 2W and 2+ AS doesn't make them very resilient. So they still fit the glass cannon concept.
I'd drop the WS 6 to WS 5, since WS6 should be limited to characters and high elves with an ice cube syndrome.

Point wise, that seems like a good starting point to start testing.

The statline was poorly formated by me... i fixed that:

M WS BS-- S-- T-- W--I---A--Ld
5-- 6-- 5-- 4-- 3-- 1-- 6-- 2-- 9
7-- 4-- 0-- 5-- 5-- 3-- 3-- 2-- 4

they were actualy T5 3W 3+save... but I agree, they should be more "glass"... all monster cavs are W3, so that stat should probably stay, the might be T4 3+save or T5 4+...


they were already designed to be good on charge with 2 S6 and 3 S5 attacks... but weaker when defending with 2S4 3 S5 attacks... and even worse, when they lost combat round... 2S4 2 S5 attacks... and I like how this can be pushd even more with devastating charge...

they could look like this:


Predator Knights 50 pt/model
Dread Knight Predator (Tyraptor?)
M WS BS-- S-- T-- W--I---A--Ld
5-- 5-- 4-- 4-- 3-- 1-- 6-- 1-- 9
7-- 3-- 0-- 5-- 5-- 3-- 3-- 2-- 4
Monstrous Cavalery Base size: 50x75mm
Unit size 3-6

Special Rules: Frenzy-mount only (Hungry?), Devastating charge (mount only) Killer Habits (Knight only), Supernatural Reflexes (Knight only)
Equipment: Lance, Heavy Armour, Shield
Options: Champ, standart, musican +10pts each



they are now 1S6 4S5 attacks on charge, 1 s4 3 S5 on defense and 1S4 2S5 in prolonged lost combat... that means, they are very strong when used well, but much weaker when not... i made them T5 4+save 50pts, but that is about a lot of testing...

[Daeron]

Hmmm.. at 3 wounds, I would give them 2+ AS, the knights 2A and make them 60 points. That latest version feels a bit weird. 3 models would come at 150 points, which is about the same price as 5 COKs (well, a little more) who would have more attacks, better armour but lower wounds and toughness. Seeing how COKs handle themselves, I wouldn't lower the attacks too much.

[Vulcan]

It's a fun idea with some elements of interest. Are you aiming for 8th ed or Age of S[hit]mar?

Since this is the 9th Age forum and not the AoS forum, I'd guess for 9th Age.

You mention the rules "Killer Habits" and "Supernatural Reflexes" but don't explain what these do. Maybe you could clarify those?

Since these are 9th Age rules, this confirms it's for 9th Age.