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Malekith's Best Friend
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Triple Game Reflection 2

Supreme Sorceress
She provided a game changing mindrazor in the game against Warriors of Chaos, but the miscast made her useless for the rest of the game. Since she wields Life magic she became much more effective in buffing the Sisters, healing up wounds of units and herself + shrine. She was a game changer in all games and provided a leadership 10 in important situations. She died against crazy nurgle magic combo but survived the other games, even under heavy enemy fire against Skaven.

9 out of 10

BSB on Manticore
He helped wiping a 20+ warriors of nurgle unit and killed enemy Hellcannon. He lost his Manticore against enemy superior magic in the first game but managed to stay alive. In second game the Manticore got killed by enemy Rock Lobba but he stayed alive. In the game against Skaven he provided a crucial re-roll for the Shrine of Slaughter only possible because of his 18" bubble and later saved the game by forcing the enemy to shoot on him. He charged a 50 man clanrat horde, and while eventually losing his Manticore he stayed alive. While he lost his Manticore in all three battles, the BSB stayed alive and was a game maker in two of the three games.

9 out of 10

Core

Darkshards
While they were less effective in the games against Warrior of Chaos and Skaven, they preventing enemy movement for the whole battle against the Orcs and Goblins, killed off crucial units of fanatics and spiders and remained effective.

8 out of 10

Dark Riders
I am slowly learning how to use my fast cavarly and that is resulting into superior movement. In the first game they stopped enemy knights long enough to eventually protect the backline, in the second game they loosening enemy Fanatics easy to kill off afterwards, while nearly panicking enemy flank on turn 1. One the heralds eventually destroyed enemy Rock Lobba on his own. In the game against Skaven they stopped the advance of two enemy scout units, while making sure I could kill his expensive 250 points assassin hero before it could my warmachines. It forced enemy to redirect his units in his backfield. Eventually they still died, but they played an important part of the games.

8 out of 10

Special

Shades
They were ineffective in the first game, mainly due no present tasks or targets. In the second game they nearly panicked enemy flank but fled from combat with ranked archer unit. In the last game against skaven they panicked enemy gutter runners and manouvred in enemy backfield for three turns, They still died or fled the battle in all games so far, but I start to learn how to use them.

8 out of 10

Cold One Knights
In the last three games the Cold One Knights played a minor part of the battle. In the first battle they hold an enemy Sorceres on Manticore long enough to concenrate my units on other flank. In second and third game they were ineffective, mainly because I was lacking to use them effectively.

7 out of 10

Reapers
Very effective and amazing. In the first battle they nearly killed off a chariot in the first turn, but failed to inflict any damage the rest of the game mainly because of bad rolls. In the game against the Orcs it were the Reapers that won me the game without any major combat, killing the enemy general and BSB, forcing 100 goblins to flee off the table, besides deleting 2 units of chaff. In the third game against Skaven they succeeded to kill off two weapon teams, a stormfiend and enemy assassin hero of 250+ points. I am very satisfied with them, especially now I learned how to deploy them. They also stayed alive all three battles.

9 out of 10

War Hydra
I really love the Hydra, he is very multifunctional and did his part all three games. In the first game he killed a full strength enemy chariot on the charge, but fled and got caught against enemy Shrine. In the second game he finished a whole flank on his own, while in the last battle he killed around 15 clanrats with shooting and nearly killed off the enemy general. His ability to heal up wounds is very nice to have in this MSU army.

9 out of 10

Rare

Doomfire Warlocks
Warlocks played a less functional role in the last three battles, and were no game changers. They still really synergies well with the army and are very effective, but I failed to use them to full extent. I have to find their specific role within the rest of the army besides providing soulblight.

7 out of 10

Sisters of Slaughter
They only saw combat in one the battles, but when it did it killed everything it touched.

9 out of 10

Bloodwrack Shrine
Same as Sisters

9 out of 10

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The 13th Legion


Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:05 am
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Deployment (after vanguard)
Image


DeGroteBaas turn 1

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

Lord Drakon turn 1

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

DeGroteBaas turn 2

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

Lord Drakon turn 2

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

DeGroteBaas turn 3

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

Lord Drakon turn 3

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

DeGroteBaas turn 4

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

Lord Drakon turn 4

Movement

Magic

Image

Shooting

Combat

Battle result
I lost 1200 points while I killed only killed a unit of dark riders, cold one chariot and his kharibdyss. We played according to tournament rules allowing me some victory points for nearly killed darkhards and dark riders resulting in a difference of 600, a minor defeat !

After battle thoughts
Altough I outshot the enemy with one more darkshards and RBT unit, his core was much more resilient because of their shields. I experienced the deadly result of sending my fast cavarly opposite his darkshards. This led to the choice to skip one of the unit of darkshards to improve all my other core with shields, musicians and both dark riders with another model.

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Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:52 pm
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I made several important changes to the list. First of all, my intention is to change it from an defensive MSU list to an agressive MSU list (less shooting, more combat oriented). I removed one darkshard unit to improve all the other core with command models and shields.

LVL 2 for warlocks
- Dark Magic
- Tome of Furion

Iron Hard Skin for Banner of Swiftness for Shrine of Slaughter.

Therefore I replaced doombolt and soulblight for power of darkness and shroud of despair. My main motivation for this is the buff of strength to the Shrine of Slaughter and possible extra power dice for my LVL 4 and Life magic (most of the times another spell). This makes the Impact Hits strength 6, Sisters and Hags strength 4 and Medusa strength 5.

Another possible game changing spell is the Shroud of Despair, I have a lot of possibilities to force leadership tests and regularly face low leadership armies like Skaven, Orcs and Goblins, Empire and Lizardmen. When I face Vampire Counts I can swap the Shroud for Bladewind against zombies etc.

What I experienced was that I did not succeeded yet to play full MSU because of inexperience and focus on the Shrine of Slaughter, which only saw combat in 5 of the 6 games because of my reservation with it. Therefore I also gave them the + 1 movement banner and advance much more as they can also function as anvil and receive a charge from killer-hordes (when buffed).

This saturday I will face Dwarfs for the first time in a local league in a scenario where we have to capture bridges in a river to win. 2400 points, so warlocks will still be there !

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The 13th Legion


Mon Mar 23, 2015 7:49 pm
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I'm returning to WFB after a long break and reading through your blog for insight. Well done work so far :)

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The Tower of the Sarathai


Wed Mar 25, 2015 5:31 pm
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Silic wrote:
I'm returning to WFB after a long break and reading through your blog for insight. Well done work so far :)

Thanks !

I will start with a local League this saturday, which goes until september. Every game we have an scenario. I will face the following players.

1 Dwarfs (high leadership)
2 Vampire Counts (immune to psychology)
3 Orcs and Goblins (low leadership)
4 Skaven (low leadership)
5 Skaven (low leadership)
6 Warriors of Chaos (high leadership)
7 Empire (average leadership)
8 Lizardmen (average leadership)
9 Vampire Counts (immune to psychology)

3 low and 2 average leaderhsip, 2 high leaderhsip and 2 immune to psychology armies. Therefore I expect to see some success with the Shroud of Despair !

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Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:29 pm
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Last saturday I played my first battle against Dwarfs in our local league based on scenarios. We played 2400 points, so I could include both LVL 2 Dark en Warlocks. The centre of the battlefield was divided by a river with two brigdes. Our objective was to capture these bridges to earn victory points. As I faced a Dwarf enemy and therefore faced an missile superior opponent I had to cross the bridges as fast as possible when his warmachines were destroyed.

The Dwarf contained the following
Runelord - Spellbreaking
Runelord - Spellbreaking
Master Engineer
Thane
10 thunderers
10 thunderers
20 quarrellers
20 hammerers
20 ironbreakers
1 Gyro
1 Cannon
1 Grudge Thrower
1 Organ Gun
15 irondrakes

Deployment
Image
We had to deploy at the same time, so no alternative deployment. My battleplan was to hide the important units like Shrine and Hydra behind a hill and then focus to take his warmachines out in turn 1 and 2. I got most space at the left bridge so that would be the crossing point to start a bottleneck. My shades got 12" behind his Grudge Thrower. He deployed in a defensive line along the river while two stubborn blocks of infantry to defend the bridges. I made a mistake with the RBT on the hill and Manticore behind the Shrine as I was unfamiliar with cannon shots.

I got
LVL 4 Life
Eart Blood
Flesh to Stone
Regrowth
Dwellers

LVL 2
Shroud of Despair
Power of Darkness
Dwarfs 1

Unfortunately the Dwarfs got first turn !

Movement
All is out of range so he marched forward with his battleline. His gyrocapter had vanguarded to shoot the Shades with its steam cannon.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
Gyro kills only 2 shades, and they hold panic test ! Organ Gun with runes and Master Engineer aims at the Shades and miss all shots ! Cannon shoots at RBT on the hill which bounces into the Hydra, resulting into 3 wounds. I was especially happy with the Shades being alive as they could now charge into his warmachines in my first turn on a roll of 7.

Combat
No Combat

Dark Elves 1

Movement
Shades charge the Grudge Thrower, need a 7 and roll.... a 6 ! Game changing failed charge as they were the only one capable of being a threat to the warmachines. They could have destroyed the Grudge Thrower and overrun, but fate decided different. The other possibility was a early doombolt to kill the entrenched Organ Gun (-2 to hit with shooting) while RBT could shot the Cannon, so warlocks move up. Also Darkshards move up to defend the second bridge while shooting in the cover of the forest.

Magic
I had a total of 9 levels of magic, 4 Life, 3 Dark and 2 Warlocks. Access to a lot of cheap spells and 3 channels (channeled one D6 every phase). The whole game my magic superiority felt very strong.

I rolled 10 for winds of magic, channeled 1 and got 11 for the first turn, nice ! The most used and nice addition to the army spells was Power of Darkness which I casted first every phase (with 2 dice). It was like a free buff every turn, somethimes even a extra dice. Especially the combination with Life magic is great, as the wound caused by generating 3 power dice is healed direct by the Life spell possible by those generated power dice. I further casted Regen and Flesh to Stone on the Shrine of Slaughter, healing the Hydra back to nearly full wounds by the attribute. Then a 6 diced normal Doombolt on his Organ Gun, but only got one 6 instead of 2, and he used the spell-eating scroll, eating Doombolt !

Image

Shooting
Which could have been a very strong first turn if Shades and Warlocks had been succesful, now my Reapers had to rescue the day ! Two could see his Cannon and the other shot at his Irondrakes. Both single shots missed, and only 2 Irondrakes got killed. Darkhards shot at the quarellers but missed all shots.

Combat
No combat :(

Dwarfs 2

Movement
His Gyro moves up to shoot the Shades, and Irondrakes move up to shoot the Warlocks.

Magic
No Magic

Image

Shooting
His cannon missed, and the rest shoots at the Warlocks, but they survive with 1 ! Im not sure now by writing the report if I already advanced with the whole army in turn 1 as it makes no sense the warlocks survived all his shooting.

Combat
No Combat

Dark Elves 2

Movement
Shades rally, rest of the army advances to cross the river. Darkshards take position at the side of the woods. Warlocks withdraw in safety.

Magic
I rolle 3 for winds of magic, channel 1. He dispells Flesh to Stone on the Shrine of Slaughter.

Image

Shooting
Reapers shoot again at the cannon, but all miss or fail to wound. Darkshards kill some quarellers and Dark Riders kill some Irondrakes.

Combat
No combat

Dwarfs 3

Movement
His gyro charges the Shades

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
He shoots with Organ on the Hydra, inflicting 3 wounds. Irondrakes finish the Hydra. His cannon shoots at the Shrine, just killing it, killing another sister and inflicting three wounds on the Manticore ! OUCH ! Without the Shrine the Sisters are suddenly no bunker anymore and feel very small and weak. Quarellers kill 4 dark riders who hold. At this moment the battle feels hopeless.

Combat
Both shades and Gyro fail to do any wounds, but he wins combat and the Shades flee, but escape.

Dark Elves 3

Movement
Losing both Hydra and Shrine I doubt if I should still advance, but it is the only way to secure that bridge. Dark Riders advances to threaten his warmachines, Sisters with both Sorceresses and Cold One Knights move up on the bridge and I make a mistake to also put the Manticore there for countercharge on his Hammerers should they charge the Sisters.

Magic
I roll 7 for winds of magic, get regen and power of darkness off but he dispells flesh to stone with a spelleating rune.

Image

Shooting
Reapers shoot again at his cannon but fail to inflict any wounds. Rest of shooting is not interesting.

Combat
No combat

Dwarfs 4

Movement
His hammerers with Thane charge the BSB on Manticore. Irondrakes block access to warmachines.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
He kills 3 sisters with Irondrakes, taking away the Regeneration. Organ gun then finished them off (only leaving the two sorceress alive). Thunderers shoot at sorceress, inflicting two wounds. Cannon kills a Reapers and other shooting kill 4 dark riders. Grudge throwers kills three cold one knights.

Combat
BSb and Manticore + Thunderstomp only inflict 4 wounds, Hammerers kill the Manticore and I lose combat with 3. BSB holds his ground.

Dark Elves 4

Movement
Feeling that even combat with the Hammerers is safer than staying outside of combat I charge the two Sorceresses in the Hammerers (with the idea I could regrow the Sisters). Cold One Knights also charges and make it even with a rune of slowness. Shades flee off the battlefield, last warlocks and dark rider gather around the combat for possible soulblight (and dark rider as target saturation for the warlock). The other dark rider flee behind the hill to possible take the bridge in last turn.

Magic
I roll 10 for winds of magic, channel 1, and power of darkness generate another 1. I heal all characters back to full health. On a soulblight he uses all his dispell dice. Therefore got to cast flesh to stone and regen. Also cast regrowth on the unit of Supreme Sorceress, but enemy argues that when they are all dead they are not a unit anymore. He seemed right, but I thought as she was still with the other Sorceress they were still a unit. Therefore regroth on Cold One Knights, bringing one back alive.

Image

Shooting
Reapers shoot again at the cannon (so they could remain alive) but fail.

Combat
I kill around 4 dwarfs, he kills my general and the cold one knights. Sorceress and BSB break and he caught the Sorceress taking the bridge. At this moment the battle is totally hopeless, but I could got 1 or even 3 victory points by staying alive a taking the bridge.

Dwarfs 5

Movement
He takes both bridges, Gyro advances towards my lines.

Magic
No Magic

Image

Shooting
Cannon kill a reaper, his other shooting kill off 9 darkshards which holds. Than other darkshards lose 4 and turn to run.

Combat
No combat

Dark Elves 5

Movement
Darkshards run off the table, last darkshard run to my side of the forest.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
I shoot at his Hammerers, kill enough to force panic test but he holds. Also shoot at his Gyro inflicting two wounds.

Combat
No combat

Dwarfs 6

Movement
Gyro moves up, rest of the army advances.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
He kills another Reaper, and kill the last darkshard.

Combat
No combat

Dark Elves 6

Movement
Dark Rider moves up for a final chance to take the bridge and rescue the battle.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
Herald kills off the Gyro, last RBT shoots at hammerers, killing enough to force panic test. But he holds.

Combat
No combat

Result : 4 - 1 for the enemy, Heroic Victory for the Dwarfs.

After battle thoughts

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Sat Mar 28, 2015 5:30 pm
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Yesterday I played with my newest updated list (Shroud Bomb) against Skaven and instead of tricking him, he tricked me ! Even worse, I baited a classical Druchii trick. The list felt very good and strong, but I made some important mistakes with deployment and movement. It resulted in a minor victory for the Skaven at the end of turn 4 when we had to stop because of time.

The Skaven list 2400 points :

General on Blood Rat Dragon (or something)
Grey Seer LVL 4
Deathmaster Snikch
BSB Chieftain
Warlock Engineer
Warlock Engineer
50 Clanrats + Mortar Team
50 Clanrats + Warpfire Thrower Team
20 Giant rats
9 Ogres
3 Jezzails
1 Warp Lighting Cannon


Deployment

Image

I started to deploy the dark riders, having four units instead of two added so much to board control as I could deploy two at both flanks. While he deployed his clanrats early on the table, I am so used to counter his most elite unit with the Shrine of Slaughter, while in this case a match up with his Clanrats spelled doom for him, especially I could get Shroud off. But Dark Riders and Cold One knight had already taken their place so Shrine was placed in the middle. Kharibdyss and Manticore match ups were the general on blood dragon rat or something (End Times ?) and latter Ogres. I had no experience against Ogres so did not know their damage output while fragilie against incoming damage (RBT fire). Because of the map the RBT had no real good spots, I deployed them behind the army. Now I see their best spot would be concentrated in the corner behind the woods to shoot his general and Ogres even with the -1 soft cover. Darkshards would take the woods as I did not expected the enemy to push through my battleline.

Magic
No dwellers, but other than that all the spells I wanted.

LVL 4 : Earth Blood, Flesh to Stone, Throne of Vines, Regrowth
LVL 2 : Shroud of Despair, Power of Darkness

Grey Seer : Skitterleap, Howling Warpgale, Scorch, The Dreaded Thirteenth
Warlock 1 : Warp Lighting
Warlock 2 : Warp Lighting

Skaven Turn 1

Movement
Ogres charge the Dark Riders because of Frenzy, but do not make it and stumble instead 5 inches forwards. His clanrat unit with the Grey Seer moves up (intentionally) while I see a juicy target for my steed master. Giant rats close the gap between Ogres and Clanrats while his General on Bloodrat moves behind the woods.

Magic
He rolls 4 for winds of magic, but still get Howling Warpgale off ! No flying movement and -1 to all my shooting, ouch !

Image

Shooting
Cannon hits the Shrine at strength 10, but only inflicts 3 wounds, pfew. I think I am going to present my Manticore next battles when facing cannon, because losing the Shrine makes the general and other LVL 2 very vulnerable in combat. Weapon Team Mortar kills 1 cold one knight, and his jezzails kill 2 dark riders.

Combat
No combat

Dark Elves Turn 1

Movement
Eager to kill his LVL 4 I charge his clanrats with my steed master (who drinks potion of foolhardiness) combined with the other unit of Dark Riders in case he challenges. Enemy seems surprised (well played sir haha!) and mocking about such a big mistake in first turn. Dark Riders at the right move up to shoot his weapon teams, Shades also move up out of sight of clanrats. Rest of the army advances maximum, while I let the cold one knights lag 4" behind. Manticore can not fly so do not really know what to do with it and it moves up.

I really make some big mistakes in this movement phase. First, every Dark Elf should know that if the enemy brings an Assassin (especially Assassin character) !!! juicy targets are only there to trick you towards the Assassin. Now I not only lost my flexible steed master into a big combat block, I also lost my second dark riders into that combat who could otherwise prevent my units from an Ogre charge with a double flee ! Secondly, Cold One Knights and BSB Manticore should never be in combat when do not charge, they have enough movement to stay way back for a counterchage. Now I made it possible for the enemy to charge my Cold One Knights with his Ogres and overrun into the BSB on Manticore !

Magic
I roll 11 for winds of magic ! But.. first roll on throne of vines with 2 dice is a total of 3, total cast of 7 while needing a 8. Broken concentration and no buffs or healed wounds this turn, ouch ! I get power of darkness off, but generate 3 power dice, inflicting 1 wound. I could get Shroud off (his Ogres where in range) but he had 6 dispell dice, and I found it to dangerous in case I got a miscast without any buff or protection on with the Shrine unit.

Image

Shooting
All shooting has -1 to hit, but I manage to kill one weapon team.

Combat
He reveals his Assassin and I realize I got tricked. Nice haha ! As we have the same weapon skill and no re-rolls while both strength 4, the dark steed master and snitch stay in combat but unharmed. Dark Riders inflict 1 wound on warlock engineer and kill a clanrat. He kills two dark riders and wins combat, but I hold.

Skaven Turn 2

Movement
His Ogres charge the Dark Riders who flee, but he redirects into the Cold One Knights and make it. His General on thingy move up, same with giant rats. He has no other units to move.

Magic
He rolls 8 for winds of magic. I dispell another Howling Warpgale. He kills 2 shades with Warp Lichting, who runs off the table. Scorch on the Darkshards kills 4 but they hold. Skitterleap is also dispelled.

Image

Shooting
Cannon misses, last weapon team misfires blows up and kill 4 clanrats. Jezzails shoot at Shrine but miss.

Combat
He kills all Cold One Knights easily while I can do 1 wound. He overruns into the BSB Manticore. Dark Steed master got wounded, but saves it before it can do D6 wounds, and he also inflict a wound on the assassin. Dark Rider got killed. I lose combat but hold again.

Dark Elves Turn 2

Movement
Both Kharibdyss and Shrine of Slaughter charge his general, Kharibdyss needing a 5, and rolls a .. 4 !! Damn. Shrine needs 3 and luckily makes it. Dark Riders moves up for rear charges and enemy cannon. Other Dark Riders blocks Giant Rats. Darkshards move up to shoot jezzails.

Magic
I roll 10 for winds of magic again, but he succesfully manage to dispell every spell by also using his scroll once (while all spells where 2 or 3 dice !) Very bad magic phase even with enough power dice. I think I am going to give the LVL 4 a sacrificial dagger, even with the Sisters costing 15 points each, with Regrowth I can always grow them back.

Image

Shooting
Darkshards kill 2 jezzails, who flee. Dark Riders kill some rats.

Combat
BSB kills a Ogre, Manticore inflict another 2 wounds. He just kills the BSB while doing 7 wounds (but saving 5 with armour) and inflict 1 wound on the Manticore. Manticore gets RAAAARGH! and passed his break test. Normally the Manticore dies before the BSB so this was nice to experience. Again, stupid mistake with movement, and also next time I will present the BSB Manticore for enemy fire for more Target Saturation for Shrine and now he never uses his Cloak of Twlight. Impact hits of the Shrine inflict 3 wounds, 1 on the general and 2 on the beast. After that I direct all my attacks to his general, but not smart ofcourse as he a 2+ armour save so dont inflict any furthwer wounds, altough Medusa inflict another the beast. He kills only 1 sister because of their amazing ward save and he loses combat but holds on a stubborn LD 9.

Skaven Turn 3

Movement
His Giant rats charge the Dark Riders, who flee again. Jezzails run off the table. Far Clanrats reform.

Magic
No rolls 8 for winds of magic, but only gets another Scorch on the Darkshards, who lose another 4.

Image

Shooting
His cannon misses

Combat
Steed master inflict another wound on the assassin (only 1 left), no wounds in return but loses combat and holds again. Manticore inflict 2 wounds and manage to stay alive with 1 wound. My handmaiden of shards challenge his. Inflict two ! wounds on his beast and eventually gets killed by his beast (but only just). He loses combat but holds

Dark Elves Turn 3


Movement
Last 3 darkshards move up, same with dark riders.

Magic
I roll 4 for winds of magic, and do not succeed in getting any spell off.

Image

Shooting
Nothing I can remember

Combat
All combat remain locked

Skaven Turn 4

Movement
Giant Rats move up, same with far Clanrats.

Magic
Re rolls 8 for winds of magic, and tries a Thirtheenth with power scrolls (making it 12+ to cast :shock: ) but I luckly dispell it ! because of it low roll.

Image

Shooting
Cannon misses again.

Combat
He kills Manticore with Ogres. Steed master kills his Assassin but finally breaks it nerves and flee and got caught by his Clanrats. I inflict some more wounds on the beast.

Dark Elves Turn 4

Movement
Dark Riders charge rear of his general. Darkshards charge his cannon. Other Dark Riders move up for charge next turn. Kharibdyss also charges ? I don't know as he was not involved in combat.

Magic
I roll 7 for winds of magic, I get power of darkness off, generating two dice, also cast Regrowth healing the unit to full strength.

Image

Shooting
Combined RBT fire on the Ogres inflict around 10 wounds, killing 3 Ogres. Dark Riders inflict another wound.

Combat
Herioc darkshards only inflict 1 wound, and two gets killed, but it ends with a draw. With strength 4 the sisters kill the beast easily, inflict another wound on the general but he lives. He runs and just escapes from the Dark Riders. Sisters reform to receive the charge from the Ogres and thing start to look good, but we have to stop the game.

I lost around 800, while lose around 300, resulting into a minor defeat for the Dark Elves.

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Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:07 am
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Shame you had to stop the game, I think you had a good change of getting the win if you had another couple of rounds.

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Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:25 am
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Amboadine wrote:
Shame you had to stop the game, I think you had a good change of getting the win if you had another couple of rounds.


I also think so, so my next objective is to learn all the rules an stats at heart, as that is what takes so much time every battle. What do you think of the changes with the list ?

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Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:32 am
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Lord Drakon wrote:

Deployment
Image


LOL!
I think this is a running joke amongst Dwarfs. My Dwarf opponent once tricked me into it as well.
- Open shooting field
- Shrunken deployment zone
- Difficult path to target
Then act all high profile like it's "tactics" and "cleverness" that makes you win the game.
This kind of game just makes me sigh. It's like going to a boxing match, where one boxer is tied down on the floor with his hands and feet, and the other one has a baseball bat. I'm sure the guy with the bat feels superior.
We could dig into detail into mistakes made and improvements. But why bother? Challenge him to a regular battle and make him cry. It's what I did ;)

EDIT:
I'm sorry.. I'm probably not showing my most sportive side. But truly, this felt like the battle was setup against you. It's unfortunate that the game can be so imbalanced in one's favour. It's a part I really dislike about the game and the scenario felt like a set-up rather than a thought-through scenario.

The only remark I can give is.. it shows a weakness to your list: range. With so little that can work at a distance, you're vulnerable to these kind of situations. But this is probably why such a scenario strikes me as imbalanced. It kills combat lists entirely. I don't see any combat list score well on this.

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Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:55 am
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ATTENTION : Druchii.net tatical advice asked !

Today I played the first half of the second battle in the local tourney we are playing. Last battle I lost 4 -1 from Dwarfs after a massacre while I was trying to cross the bridge. Now I hope to at least score some points, but things are looking grim. Therefore I need a good plan how to tranform a current 2 - 3 Narrow Defeat into a Legendary Victory as I have still a lot of killing power left and three turns !

We both had to deploy HQ on our side of the battlefield and deploy a unit of maximum 20 infantry models. It could not be entered by characters, and anything else than infantry.

Image

Victory points
Draw (2 - 2) : Both players control HQ, no players has control HQ
Narrow Victory (3 - 2) : One player controls an HQ, other don't control HQ
Heroic Victory (4 - 1) : Player controls two HQ's
Legendary Victory (5 - 0) : All enemy units of destroyed or fleeing

At this moment, at least a 2 - 3 narrow defeat is secured, but I could maybe turn it into a Legendary Victory by destroying or routing the enemy army.

Deployment

Magic
LVL 4 Life : Flesh to Stone, Throne of Vines, Regrowth, Dwellers
LVL 2 Dark : Power of Darkness, Shroud of Despair

Grey Seer : The Dreaded Thirteenth Spel, Plague, Pestilent Breath, Scorch
Warlock : Warp Lightning
Warlock : Howling Warpgale

Image

The enemy deploys his slaves and clanrats in the middle. His Stormvermin are deployed near his HQ, while his Ogres and Giant Rats are deployed opposite my HQ. As I experienced last time the killing power of the Ogres, but their fragility against my RBT shooting, I deployed the RBT on the hill near the HQ and in the corner. Medusa would go on Grey Seer killing mission, Shrine of Slaughter after the Clanrat unit, hopefully routing the slaves with a Shroud Bomb and Witches flanked by Kharibdyss to capure enemy HQ. Dark Riders and Steed Master shoot off enemy weapon teams, while combined charge of Cold One Knights and Manticore would finish off enemy rats and ogres and then reinforce the centre.

Image

Skaven Turn 1

Movement
His Ogres and Giant rats advance towards my HQ. Slaves move up towards the centre and Storvermin and Clanrats advance towards the middle (likely to shuffle back after first turn as enemy did the former battles).

Magic
Enemy got 12 for winds of magic. He kills 4 witches with scorch, fails an Thirtheenth and I dispell a Howling Warpgale.

Image

Shooting
Doomrocket misses, Mortar misses.

Combat
No combat

Dark Elves Turn 1

Movement
Witch Elves advance towards the HQ to charge enemy Slaves, backed by Kharibdyss for re-roll succesfull leadership tests and Terror. Shrine of Slaughter advcances towards enemy clanrats and Grey Seer. Cold One Knights and Medusa move up to charge the enemy if he comes to close. Dark Riders and Steed master move up to shoot off enemy weapon teams. BSB on Manticore also moves up to charge enemy if he comes to close, but I make a mistake with deployment as I put him in enemy front arc instead of flank. Two Dark Riders move through the forest and one dies by dangerous terrain test. Forest becomes Wildwood and kill another 2.

Magic
I roll 10 for winds of magic. Throne of Vines is dispelled, Power of Darkness fails, Flesh to Stone on Witch Elves and Dwellers on Slaves also fail. I sacrifice two sisters but fail to get a 4. Bad rolls, ugh !

Image

Shooting
Combined RBT fire kill two Ogres, Darkshards kill the packmasters, 7 to go and Stupidity! Dark Steed master inflict two wounds on the Ratling gun, but he saves them both :( Both dark Riders wounds are also saved.

Combat
No combat

Skaven Turn 2

Movement
Ogres faill stupidity and stumble 6 inch forwards. Giant rats move up to the HQ. Rest of the army shuffles back as expected.

Magic
Enemy got 12 for winds of magic again. He casts a Howling Warpgale with 3 dice, and my roll with 4 dice is terrible. He uses his power scroll and only needs 13 for Thirteenth, succeeds and kill off 10 witches ! Plague on Sisters is dispelled.

Image

Shooting
Ratling misfire but does not explode. Mortar kill another 3 witches as they don't test on my tougness 5.

Combat
No combat

Dark Elves Turn 2

Movement
Witches charge Slaves, Kharibdyss fails to roll a 7 (6 again). Both Cold One Knights and BSB Manticore charge the Giant Rats and make it, but because they are both in Giant Rats front arc, the Manticore automaticly fails because he doesn't fit in. I really don't know why but I don't charge the enemy Ratling with my Terror causing Steed Master (as I am within 9" movement so no stand and shoot...) but that is a huge mistake. Also Dark Riders just stand still and chill in the hope to shoot it off (very dumb with howling on..). Other Dark Riders move up to shoot enemy weapon team and possible charge it next turn. Sisters move up for turn 3 charge on clanrats, and Medusa move up for possible combined charge on Slaves with Kharibdyss or Grey Seer killing mission.

Magic
I roll 7 for winds of magic, Throne of Vines and Power of Darkness is dispelled, but regrowth gets 2 witches back (doubling the unit to 5)

Image

Shooting
RBT fire kill another two Ogres (5 left). Dark Steed master again inflicts two wounds on the Ratling, but both are again saved :( All Dark riders fail and darkshards fail to hit anything.

Combat
Witches kill 7 slaves, but lose 4. They lose combat but holds LD 9 because of the general. Cold One Knights kill around 6 rats, and lose none in return. They win combat but enemy holds steadfast on LD 8 because of ranks.

Skaven Turn 3

Movement
Enemy Ogres charge darkshards (which I did not expected for as I thought only infantry could attack the building) but discovered all other units could fight it to kill the garrison. I miss all stand shoot shots. His clanrat units shuffles back.

Magic
Enemy gets 11 for winds of magic, he tries another Warpgale which I dispell, then with his Grey Seer mushrooms he gets off Plague on the Shrine of Slaugter, killing 4 sisters and inflicting wounds on both sorceresses. Ouch.

Image

Shooting
Ratling inflict 5 wounds on the Steed Master, I save 3 and he is dead. Mortar kill another two sisters (only 2 left for combat !)

Combat
Giant rats kill one Cold One Knights, but they kill enough to leave enemy with one flank. They lose combat and break, just escaping the Cold Ones pursue by 1 because the Skaven special rule. Darkshards inflict one wound on the Ogres and therefore kill one (4 left) in return they kill 5 + 3 with stomp. Last witch elf kill two Slaves but is killed in return.

Dark Elves Turn 3

Movement
Cold One Knights charge fleeing Giant Rats. BSB Manticore charges the Ogres. Kharibdyss and Medusa charge into the Slaves. Shrine of Slaughter charges clanrats. Dark Rider charge enemy weapon team and other Dark Riders move up for next turn Ratling gun charge (or hopefully wound it finally)

Magic
I roll 5 for winds of magic. He dispels power of darkness, flesh to stone and scrolls regrowth. A lot of low rolls here again.

Image

Shooting
I totally forgot the RBT's this turn I see.. Dark Riders shoot at ratling, inflict two wounds, but he saves them, again.

Combat
BSB Manticore inflict 3 wounds, with Cloak of Twilight he inflict a total of 7 wounds, killing two ogres and inflicting a wound on the third one, wow ! Manticore kills off the wounded Rat Ogre, but unfortunately his last Ogre has 6 attacks and kill off my last two Darkshards (only just!) and I therefore lose my HQ (resulting in the 3 - 2 current position). Ogre breaks and flee, BSB Reforms.

Cold One Knights only just caught the enemy Giant Rats after he rolls 11 for fleeing, they reform towards the Clanrats.

Medusa kill around 6 slaves with her attacks and avert your gaze. Kharibdyss kill another 10 with his attacks and Thunderstomp. He fail to inflict to any wounds and lose combat but hold on steadfast LD 10.

Dark Rider fail to inflict any wounds, horse succeeds, but is saved..

Then.. the matchup I was waiting for, for so long, Shrine of Slaughter against enemy Clanrats with Grey Seer. With only two sisters left and no buffs up it was going to be very dangerous, but if they could remain alive and win combat, the enemy had to test on LD 6. He fails Fear test! He reveals Deathmaster Snitch, who attacks the Shrine in hope of D6 wounds, but fail to wound because of high tougness. My handmaiden of shard kills off enemy Warlock. Other sisters inflict a wound on Deathmaster Snitch. We forgot to place the Grey Seer now in combat, which I could have otherwise attack with the Medusa and Shrinekeepers.. Medusa kills off his enemy champion. Shrinekeepers fail to kill but Impact Hits and Avert your Gaze kill 7 rats. His returning spearman do 12 attacks on the sisters, 3 hits, 2 wounds.. I roll two 4's for armour saves, and two 2's for ward saves :cry: killing off the sisters and leaving my sorceress in combat and returning his rank LD !! He loses combat but passed LD 9 steadfast break test.

We had to stop the game because of time, but because it is a game of the local tourney we have to finish it ! :D This saturday we will continue, and now I need to try to change the current 2 - 3 minor defeat into a legendary victory by killing or routing his whole army, or a 2 -2 draw by destroying his gutter runners in his HQ.

The current situation

Image

Image

Image

Both my sorceresses, and therefore magic casters are in combat, both with only 1 wound left and no protection whatsoever. The Shrine still has 4 wounds left. But because I killed his warlock and champion, his Grey Seer is now also in base contact with my Shrine. If I can kill his Grey Seer with the Shrine, we are both without magic !

Cold One Knights and BSB Manticore are not close enough to charge in my turn 4, but can be in position for a turn 5 charge. Should I only send the Knights towards the Clanrats, or also the BSB Manticore ?

Two RBT can shoot at the garrison in enemy HQ, but only hit at 7's (long range, hard cover, skirmishers). Dark Riders can charge them ?

What should you do ? Do you think it is possible to rout / destroy the enemy army, or should I concentrate on killing the enemy gutter runners in his HQ for a draw ?

All feedback is welcome, as this game is still ongoing !

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Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:49 pm
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Part 2

Skaven Turn 4

Movement
The last Ogre decides it is better to live another day and flee off the board. His other blocks stay where they are. His Warlock Engineer not shown in the map moves forwards.

Magic
He gets a spell off but inflict damage to hit own units, killing the weapon team and inflicting 4 wounds on the clanrats and slaves.

Image

Shooting
Ratling gun shoots at the Kharibdyss and inflict 1 wound.

Combat
Kharibdyss and Medusa kill enough Slaves to get rid off the steadfast, they explode but don't inflict any damage. He kills my general with his assassin, and my Shrine manage to kill his Grey seer. His clanrats finish off my Dark sorceress. Combat is a draw so he wins with musician but I pass break test

Dark Elves Turn 4

Movement
Cold One Knigts pass stupidity and move up for flank charge on clanrats, Dark riders charge his Ratling gun in the flank. BSB on Manticore moves up for next turn charge and Kharibduss move up to charge his tower or stormvermin unit. Far RBT move up. I make a mistake to charge the last dark rider in the clanrat flank for combat resolution.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
RBT shoot off the warlock engineer and miss

Combat
Dark riders kill gatling, and I overrun into the stormvermin to prevent them from charging the Kharibdyss. Other Dark Rider is killed. Shrine inflict tthree wounds, but I lose combat again and hold.

Skaven Turn 5

Movement
No moves

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
No shooting

Combat
Dark riders are killed. Shrine remains locked in combat but holding on its last wound.

Dark Elves Turn 5

Movement
I go all-in (mistake) by charging everything in the stormvermin, while cold ones charge the clanrats in the flank.

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
Shooting fail to hit the garrison

Combat
His assassin kills a cold one knight, and he succeed killing the Shrine. I lose combat and cold one knights flee, making the 5 - 0 impossible. BSB Manticore is challenged by his champ, Kharibdyss inflict two wounds on the general, while Medusa kills around 4 stormvermin. I win combat but he holds on steadfast LD 10.

Skaven Turn 6

Movement
Clanrats move towards the combat

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
No shooting

Combat
His general challenges my BSB Manticore and gets killed, Kharibdyss inflict 10 wounds combined with thunderstomp, Medusa another 7.

Dark Elves Turn 6

Movement
Cold One Knights rally

Magic
No magic

Image

Shooting
RBT shoot at clanrats and kill around 6 but fail to force panic test.

Combat
Combined attacks and Thunderstomps and avert your gave kill around 20 stormvermin and enemy BSB, leaving him with 2 ranks, but still steadfast and LD 10 because of the tower.

Result:
3 - 2 loss for Dark Elves.

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Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:37 pm
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Triple Game Reflection 3

After losing the first two battles of our local tourney, and two more against Skaven and Dark Elves I really feel certain things are missing or lacking the list. The first main conclusion was that my core of 3 units of darkshards with 2 dark riders units underperformed. This made me change the core to 2 units of darkshards and two of dark riders, but well equiped with shields and command. After that I tried 4 units of dark riders, which was really nice, but I found that what I was really missing was another combat block besides the Shrine of Slaughter. In the last battle I brought 20 witch elves, which attracted enemy shooting towards them instead of the sisters, but the sisters still died before them reached combat, as also happened in the battle against dwarfs. In both cases this also spelled doom for my magic casters and shrine. I took life to keep them alive, but most of my magic phases were not dangerous to the enemy and not game changing. Also the sisters felt underused as bunker / bodyguard instead of gladiator unit so I have to come to the conclusion that the Shrine of Slaughter is not ready for me yet. Also the current discussions around the Leadership Bomb has convinced me to learn how to play with such psych-tactics. As a result the army list has been changed to a large extent.

T.E.R.R.O.R List

Supreme Sorceress, Level 4, Sacrificial Dagger - Death Magic
Master, BSB, Manticore, Lance, Heavy Armor, Sea Dragon Cloak, Shield, Cloak of Twilight
Sorceress, Level 2, Tome of Furion - Dark Magic
Master, Dark Steed, Heavy Armour, Shield, SDC, Tormentor Sword, Charmed Shield, Dragonbane gem, Mask of Eee

6 Dark riders, Musician, Shields, RXB
6 Dark riders, Musician, Shields, RXB
33 Dreadspears, Full Command, Banner of Swiftness

5 Cold One Knights
Reaper Bolt Thrower
Reaper Bolt Thrower
Reaper Bolt Thrower

10 Sister of Slaughter, Standard Bearer, Banner of Eternal Flame
Kharibdyss
Medusa
Bloodwrack Shrine

Total: 2397

Motivation behind the list

Dreadspear + Sacrifical Dagger
The dreadspear block is crucial to this Shroud bomb version, as they provide the power dice which are needed to make Shroud tactics work as winds of magic can be low and you have to completely dominate in the magic phase. Following test cases of other armies and my own experience is that low winds of magic at the wrong moment lead to current failures. I combine them with a Bloodwrack Shrine for add a total of 10 ranks. This give me the possibilty to keep the casters safe in the second rank, and I can lose / sacrifice 25 dreadspears and still maintain 3 ranks. Also very important is that it adds Terror and therefore fear tests combined with a -1 LD for enemy units within 6" while making themselves steadfast LD 10.

Magic
Death Magic allows for the most magical synergy with Shroud of Despair by lowerling enemy LD with -3 and sniping enemy characters. Dark Magic with Tome of Furion gives me Shroud of Despair and possible Word of Pain, or otherwise Doombolt. All Death Magic spells are dangerous and Purple Sun can really devastate those armies immune to Shroud. Also in other Druchii threats this conclusion has been made, so I will learn how to use Death and how to combine it with the Shroud. Also great for generating power dice for an tactic where magic is so important.

Terror
I have two very mobile terror causers, both masters. The Kharibdyss also causes terror, but especially can force the enemy to re-roll succesfull leadership tests or cancel the enemy BSB roll out. The Shrine let the Dreadspear bunker cause terror. More important that the terror they cause, which can harvest in the following turn a Shroud has been casted, they also cause fear. Even when I don't get Shroud off but Doom and Darkness at the unit in combat with the Dreadspears that is - 4 LD. As both masters can charge units from 18" charge they can be in crucial combats or make crucial charges when needed. The steed master can join units, so the sisters of slaughter or dark riders to give them terror.

Fear
Both Cold One Knights and Medusa are movement 7, so still very mobile and can be in combat with units in the shroud bubble.

Other LD tests
The combined shooting of RBT can force panic tests where needed, while dark riders units can capitalize on movement leadership tests as frenzy, reform etc. Extra touch is the master with the tormentor sword, as he can give monsters or characters stupidity for the remainder of the game. Medusa can also help in the movement game.

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Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:58 pm
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Thanks for sharing your progress. Will try and comment further when I am on a PC rather than phone.

The effort is much appreciated however.

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Tue Apr 14, 2015 9:12 pm
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Today I played with my new list for the first time, of which the main changes are Death Magic, LVL 4 Death with Dagger in unit of 35 Dreadspears and Sisters solo with Flaming Banner. I already know that I will be playing this list for at least the next 10 battles, especially the magic phase felt sooo powerfull. I played against Vampire Counts, so no psychology, neutralizing a lot of this lists potential. But, this battle can show that Shroud Bomb lists are also very capable of dealing with such lists. The game ended after 4.5 turns in a draw in my favour (1075 - 1270) mainly because of some mistakes I made.

LVL 4 - Death with dagger in spears
In every magic phase I dominated because of the dagger. I could cast Spirit Leech and The Cares of Laniph with only 1 dice, generating another one with sacrificed spears. Soulblight was casted with 2 dice and Purple Sun with 3 dice. This extra 4 dice generated costed me about 6 spears, but a total of 4 spells in both phases. In this case both snipe spells where not so dangerous because of his high leadership and good rolls, but Death spells also generating dice was strong. Combined with two spells with LVL 2 - Dark, in this case doombolt and bladewind gave me a lot of damage potential. How I experienced it, with a block of spears/bleakswords and a LVL 4 with dagger is the way to make an Shroud Bomb work. Death is also the lore to go, as it also generated power dice, are very cheap to cast, and every spell is a spell the enemy must dispell, especially when you face low leadership armies as sniping is more dangerous in those cases. My LVL 4 had Spirit Leech, Cares of Laniph, Soulblight and Purple Sun, but imagine I have Spirit Leech, Doom and Darkness, Soulblight (or another snipe) and Purple Sun in normal cases all of these spells can wreck the enemy army.

Deployment
Image

The Vampire Counts list included the following

Master Necromancer
Vampire
Vampire

40 crypt ghouls
20 skeletons
5 dire wolves

6 crypt horros
3 vargheists
9 black knights

terrogheist
varghulf

Flaming Gladiators
I did some playtesting the the Sisters against vargheists, varghulf, crypt horrors and terrorgheist. They are capable of destroying the varghulf and vargheists even before they can hit, with a luck little luck the same for terrorgheist. crypt horrors are destroed within 2 rounds of combat. For a unit of only 170 points (flaming banner) this is amazing.

I made a big mistake by deploying them opposite the vargheists in the urge to protect the Reapers, if I had deployed them at the other flank opposite the Crypt Horrors I am sure the battle would have been totally different ! When they finally reached combat against the Ghouls they killed around 11 on their own crumbling the whole unit and vampire, earning back their points in only 1 round of combat.

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Wed Apr 15, 2015 10:19 pm
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Man, you are writing faster than I am able to read! :shock: :D Good work!

I have a small comment to your latest list: I think equipping the pegasus master as you did is incorrect. You have quite a few terror causers, you do not gain that much by adding one more. In addition, the tormentor sword only gets in effect if the enemy character survives combat with you as you do not test it while in close combat. This means either he wins (but this is not what you want, shroud or not) or flees successfully (which does not happen that often). I think you should equip the master to kill things and survive them, say with talisman of preservation and charmed shield or dawnstone + dragonhelm + TOTS + great weapon.

In general, the shroud is something that might but might not work. How many tests are you capable of inflicting in a turn, five? Shooting some fast cav, magicking some fast cav (the spell is not likely to go through however if you have cast shroud already), fear in some close combat, hopefully a break test. Most of the time they will be at Ld7 at least, probably more. You have to be prepared for the occasion only a few insignificant ones are failed. Besides, your opponent might be able to spread out his forces so that only a few enemies are hit. Your sorceress is not particularly mobile after all.

Besides, you are somewhat short on anti-armour options. The master would be a good help. As it is now, Empire or Chaos in the armour wall flavour might be difficult to play against.

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Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:15 am
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Marchosias wrote:
Man, you are writing faster than I am able to read! :shock: :D Good work!

I have a small comment to your latest list: I think equipping the pegasus master as you did is incorrect. You have quite a few terror causers, you do not gain that much by adding one more. In addition, the tormentor sword only gets in effect if the enemy character survives combat with you as you do not test it while in close combat. This means either he wins (but this is not what you want, shroud or not) or flees successfully (which does not happen that often). I think you should equip the master to kill things and survive them, say with talisman of preservation and charmed shield or dawnstone + dragonhelm + TOTS + great weapon.

In general, the shroud is something that might but might not work. How many tests are you capable of inflicting in a turn, five? Shooting some fast cav, magicking some fast cav (the spell is not likely to go through however if you have cast shroud already), fear in some close combat, hopefully a break test. Most of the time they will be at Ld7 at least, probably more. You have to be prepared for the occasion only a few insignificant ones are failed. Besides, your opponent might be able to spread out his forces so that only a few enemies are hit. Your sorceress is not particularly mobile after all.

Besides, you are somewhat short on anti-armour options. The master would be a good help. As it is now, Empire or Chaos in the armour wall flavour might be difficult to play against.


Thanks for the comments, they are really apprecieted as it was your battle log that inspired me to start my own ! As I am set to make the Shroud work I will optimize the list in order to do so, looking forward to all the feedback out there :D

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Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:44 am
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What about this list ?

8 drops

Dreadlord 299
- Pegasus
- Lance
- Heavy Armour
- Sea Dragon Cloak
- Dragonhelm
- Dawnstone
- Cloak of Twilight

Supreme Sorceress 295
- Level 4
- Death Magic
- Sacrificial Dagger
- Ring of Hotek

Master 209
- BSB
- Pegasus
- Lance
- Shield
- Sea Dragon Cloak
- Heavy Armour
- Talisman of Preservation
- Charmed Shield

Sorceress 175
- Level 2
- Dark Magic
- Tome of Furion
- The mask of EEE
- Dark Steed

Core 600

6 Dark riders, herald, musician, shields, RXB 140
5 Dark riders, shields, RXB 100
35 Dreadspears, full command, banner of swiftness 360

Special 280

4 Reaper Bolt Throwers 280

Rare 545

1 Kharibdyss 160
8 Warlocks, master of warlocks 210
1 Bloodwrack Shrine 175

Total: 2400

I gave up the sisters of slaughter, BSB manticore and cold one knights for a large unit of warlocks and peglord + pegmaster. Shroud Sorceress got a dark steed and joins the warlocks so she is very mobile and can place the bomb in the middle of enemy forces. I really want to maintain at least 3 terror causers, so she get the mask of eee.

2 extremely mobile fear causers (peg masters) and terror causing warlock bodyguard + terror kharibdyss and terror block of 35 spears + bloodwreck shrine (10 ranks deep) with the daggering supreme sorceress with ring of hotek.

4 RBT to maximize shooting

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Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:36 am
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It has been more than 1 month since my latest post here as I had to prepare for exams but also because I lacked the motivation to write any battle reports as I got massacred every time because of stupid mistakes and deployments. Not in the way that I could learn from those mistakes, but something essentially wrong with how is used the army. As I was preparing for the exams I had some time to think and read how to improve my play. One of the other battle rapport poster Dark Reaper Witchstar list took my interest, especially the tactical discussion around the strategic strength and weaknesses of the list. Based on those findings and my own preferences, I came up with this list


Dreadlord 249
- General
- Heavy Armour
- Sea Dragon Cloak
- Ogre Blade
- Enchanted Shield
- Ring of Hotek

Supreme Sorceress 340
- LVL 4
- Light Magic
- Cloak of Twilight
- Power Scroll
- Dark Pegasus

Sorceress 115
- LVL 1
- Light Magic
- Dispell Scroll
- Dark Steed

Sorceress 90
- LVL 1
- Light Magic
- Dark Steed

BSB Death Hag 300
- Cauldron of Blood

7 Dark Riders, Shields, RXB 140
5 Dark Riders, Shields, RXB 100
26 Witch Elves, Full Command, Razor Standard 361

5 Shades, AHW 90
5 Shades, AHW 90
5 Shades, AHW 90
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70

5 Warlocks 125
10 Sisters of Slaughter, Standard Bearer, Banner of Eternal Flames 170

The concept here is simple, I have one durable and strong unit of core tax (witch elves) combined with a Druchii Light Council. Light works very good with a Witchstar as all its augments spells are amazing for it (Pha's Protection, Timewarp, Speed of Light) while the council on its own provide another threat. Three units of Shades and two RBT provide a very strong shooting phase already in turn 1, which can make use of enemy mistakes with deployment. I combined this with a unit of warlocks and Druchii Gladiators (Sisters of Slaughter) with flaming banner to have an answer for most enemy threats.

The main mistakes I made in my battles was that I was not patient. I just advances with my infantry block for a head on fight, not using my ranged and mobile superiority. I also didn't played the game in several phases (early, middle and late game) so first taking out enemy chaff, setting up for main combat etc.

Today I got my revanche against Warriors of Chaos who massacred this list to the last man (I fielded a large unit of Sisters instead of Dreadlord and Light Magic).

Dark Elves vs Warriors of Chaos 2400 points

Spells
Supreme Sorceress : Shems Gaze, Pha's Porection, Banishment, Birona's Timewarp
Sorceress : Shems Gaze
Sorceress : Light of Battle
Warlocks : Doombolt, Soulight

Dployment
I put my Dark Riders to both flanks, while enemy also deploys his Marauder Horsemen of both flanks. Warlocks are also deployed at the right flank, and Witch Elves + Council take left flank, opposing enemy forces. Druchii Gladiators would take right flank, while Witches the center, as that would make it very hard for enemy Chaos Knights to charge my Gladiators. I put a RBT there for crossed fire and to hopefully attract the enemy knights away from the main combat. My shades are deployed opposide Marauders to take them out as soon as possible, and after that their mission is to shoot off enemy Warriors of pick off wounds the Chariots.

Image

Vanguard :
His Marauder Horsemen on the right flank vanguard behind the Chaos Knights for protection of the Shades. My Dark Riders advance at the right redeploy towards the centre, while the bunker for Light Council moves up to be in shooting range of this left Marauders. Warlocks advance at the right flank.

Dark Elves Turn 1
I got first turn because of the + 1 ! Since I changed my MSU list towards the Deathstar list I get to start most of the time now, which gives me a huge advantage in the chaff war. Nothing charges. My right flank advances, Witchstar in the center moves up. Druchii Gladiators position theirselves at the left flank of the Witches for possible flank charges and to protect that flank.

In Magic I get 7 vs 4 and one of the Sorceresses uses 6 dice for boosted Shems Gaze on the Hellcannon (2D6 strength 6 hits with 48") which goes through ! 1 wound to the Hellcannon and two Chaos Dwarfs die. The first unit of Shades aim their deadly crossbows towards lightly armoured Marauder Horsemen and kill 4 ! Aware that holding their ground will cost them their lives they choose to flee the battlefield ! Shades at the right flank need 6'es to hit the hiding Marauder Horsemen, but not for nothing are they the best scouts of the game and they also kill 3 !! Again the Horsemen loses their nerves and even in range of the BSB flag, they flee the battlefield. Both Reapers aim for singleshots at enemy Chariots but both miss. A wounded Hellcannon while also removing all enemy chaff in the first turn of magic & shooting !

Image

Warriors of Chaos Turn 1
Feeling the pain of Dark Elves bolts and light magic missiles the Warriors of Chaos advance as fast as they can. The Deamon in the Hellcannon is raged by the damage inflicted and the dwarfs are unable to control him so he advances also. Shrine moves through forest, fails its dangerous terrain test but is warded.

Magic is 6 vs 4 and enemy tries to cast T lowering spell on the Witches. I think he actually rolled two 1's but I forgot the Ring of Hotek for a moment, I dispelled it with all my dice. He then casts a magic missile on the Dark Riders in the centre, and all but once vanish into the flames of Chaos. But the disciplined musician holds his ground for possibile flee blocking (I forgot for a moment the snake eyes rule). As Hellcannon move he can't shoot.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 2
Now the enemy chaff has gone, the Dark Elves force continue to encircle the enemy. Witchstar shuffles back while the heroic Gladiators present theirselves to the Hellcannon. Two units of Shades move up, while one present himself as bait to draw one of the enemy Chariots early. As this is the turn for Banishment of the Deamon Prince, Light Council retreats and Supreme Sorceress moves 24" from the Deamon Prince. Warlocks move up to rear charge the enemy Chariot or Shrine.

Magic is 7 vs 5 but both sorceresses channel an extra power dice ! I cast soulblight on the Deamon Prince, which is let through and 6 dice Banisment on the Deamon Prince, which enemy fails to dispell. Banishment inflict 3 wounds and Deamon Prince is left on only 1 wound ! Shades kill three Warriors, inflict a wound on the left Chariot. Left RBT single shots enemy Chariot but misses, but right RBT kills an enemy Chaos Knight. Both the Deamon Prince and Hellcannon wounded the battle is clearly turning into my advantage.

Image

Warriors of Chaos Turn 2
Chariot charges the Shade bait, and the flee, after he redirects into my Gladiators. Hellcannon also charges Gladiators (yes!) while Chaos Knights charges the lone Dark Rider musician who flees (only to discover he will not rally :( ) and they make it into the far right RBT. This essentially make them redirect them away from the main battle, to mission accomplished. Rest of the army are still out of range so advances. Deamon Prince, knowing that next turn he would be banished/charged to death moves up to some inches of the Supreme Sorceress

Magic is 10 vs 7 (1 channel) and enemy cast dangerous spell on the Supreme Sorceress, which I dispell with four dice. Enemy uses 6 dice for another dangerous spell on her, but not IR so I use my scroll as this was the most dangerous enemy magic phase.

Enemy knights make short work of the RBT and we move to Gladiator vs Hellcannon & Chariot battle. As Chariots smashed into combat in inflict three wounds with Impact Hits, but two of the skilled Gladiators jump away right on time and only 1 got killed. 7 Gladiators turn their 11 attacks towards the hellcannon, hitting everything (re-roll 2's to hit) and inflicting three wounds because of their wounding of 5's (also little mistake from me was that they were outside re-roll to wound COB range) and just kill it ! Amazing unit these Sisters of Slaughter. Horrified by the skill and discipline of the Druchii Gladiators the Chariot crew missed their attacks and run away !

Image

In my turn the Shades charge the fleeing Chariot who flees off the battlefield, and unfortunately the enemy concedes after these two turns. He indeed rolled very poorly all game long, and my list combined with tactical and patient play was a very poor matchup for him.

Most important was that I was patient, but also that the list was very strong. Its not easy to take a lot of points, as they are preseverd in the Light Council and Witchstar, while the other units take out enemy units very fast. MVP were ofcourse the Druchii Gladiators by killing the enemy Hellcannon and winning combined combat with it and an charging Chaos Chariot.

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Sat May 23, 2015 12:22 pm
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Nice game and write up.

Thought your opponent should have played a bit longer tho' :P

You used Dark Reaper's template well. Looking forward to seeing more from this style list of yours.

P.S. I think the flanking unit of 10 SoS might be an under-used gem in DE competitive lists. What other infantry can take chariot/monster charges like they can? or add such a threatening combo charge? :twisted:

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Sat May 23, 2015 8:43 pm
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Thank you for the reply !

I remember your critical feedback on his list regarding difficulty with armour and the lack of a second combat unit. I think that 1 uber unit (deathstar) made out of core-tax can be much better in preserving points + points for investing into ranged threats but the SoS make a perfect low cost second unit capable of winning or holding important secondary battles. Also in cases of scenario's like Watchtower these are the perfect garrison.

While Dark Reaper invested in Reaper Bolt Throwers and Warlocks, I hope that with a little more Shades and the Light Council I can provide the same ranged threat, but more mobile and more reliable. More games are needed to see if this is indeed true.

Multiple enemy +1 armoured units will still present a challenge, but if I can finish off the enemy chaff as I did now, enemy knights are the second unit opponents are likely to send after the RBT because of their speed over infantry (and Steam Tanks are just not send after WM). I really look forward how the SoS would endure combat with a Steam Tank, but as long as they can lock it instead of the Steam Tank locking my witches, I'm fine !

My biggest concern is that I lack the ultimate WM hunter (cloaked pegmaster) but Light really helps me to cover up this weakness with Shems Gaze, Banisment, Pha's Protection and ofcourse the Net of Amyntok.

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Sat May 23, 2015 11:04 pm
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Tomorrow I will face the Vampire Counts for a local tourney of around 10 players. Because of earlier losses I am ranked at the bottom line, but Lord Drakon is back and determined to make an comeback.

The scenario only allows you to take one lvl 1, and there is a tower of annulment placed in the centre of the battle. As long as the tower is closed every have an 2+ ward save against magical attacks, spells etc. You can open the tower by placing units in base contact and roll (in order of Initiative) a D6. It opens when you roll equal or below the number of turns. When you open it you free a LVL 4 varying from Deamon Prince to Slann for your cause.

Image

As my normal list contains a lot of magic users, this give me some points for nice try outs !

Dreadlord (Lord Drakon) 564
- General
- Black Dragon
- The Black Amulet
- Dawnstone
- OTS
- Lance
- Shield
- Heavy Armour
- Sea Dragon Cloak

Sorceress 115
- LVL 1
- Light Magic
- Dispell Scroll
- Dark Steed

BSB Death Hag 380
- Cauldron of Blood
- Rune of Khaine
- Ogre Blade

7 Dark Riders, Shields, RXB 140
5 Dark Riders, Shields, RXB 100
26 Witch Elves, Full Command, Razor Standard 361

5 Shades, AHW 90
5 Shades, AHW 90
5 Shades, AHW 90
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70

10 Sisters of Slaughter, Handmaiden of Shards, Standard Bearer, Banner of Eternal Flames 180
10 Sisters of Slaughter, Handmaiden of Shards 160


The enemy list will likely have a blender vampire lord or vampire on coven throne and some other vampires, large unit of ghouls, two average units of skeletons, zombies, one unit of 5 direwolfs. 3 vargheists, 1 varghulf, 6 crypt horrors, 10 black knights and one terrorgheist.

I am especially looking forward to use a Black Dragon and two units !! of my beloved Sisters of Slaighter.

Any initial battle advise is welcome !

Suggestion Marchosias

Dreadlord (Lord Drakon) 553
- General
- Black Dragon
- Armour of Destiny
- Dawnstone
- Potion of Strength
- Lance
- Shield
- Sea Dragon Cloak

Sorceress 140
- LVL 1
- Light Magic
- Hex Scroll
- Dark Steed

BSB Death Hag 380
- Cauldron of Blood
- Rune of Khaine
- Ogre Blade

6 Dark Riders, Musician, Shields, RXB 130
5 Dark Riders, Musician, Shields, RXB 110
26 Witch Elves, Full Command, Razor Standard 361

5 Shades, AHW 90
5 Shades, AHW 90
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70
Reaper Bolt Thrower 70

10 Sisters of Slaughter, Handmaiden of Shards, Standard Bearer, Banner of Eternal Flames 180
10 Sisters of Slaughter 150


2394

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Last edited by Lord Drakon on Wed May 27, 2015 11:48 am, edited 4 times in total.



Tue May 26, 2015 10:37 am
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Every vampire is a lvl1 caster. He will have a blender lord but only one of them. Otherwise, he is only allowed to bring wight kings, cairn wraiths and baanshees as heroes.

This scenario is quite stupid. I am afraid it will be decided by who will be able to open the tower. A free demon prince is a huge boost. Ideally, you want to have three units of yours knocking on the door and none of your opponent. The question is how much would you sacrifice to achieve this. Basically, unless it would mean his deathstar charging you and overrunning too close for comfort, scout shades so that they can either try to open the door or redirect/tie in combat other units that would want to have a go.

I am not sure black amulet is good for a dragon rider. The enemy will just attack the dragon. A killy vampire lord is able to kill the mount before it strikes. After that, your lord will be likely to run because of combat resolution. There are two ways to fix this: either you can mount the lord on a pegasus (or steed), or you can swap for a cheaper 4++ and avoid the blender lord.

One of his characters will most likely wear nightshroud, an item that confers ASL on enemies in base contact and robs them of their bonuses to strength granted by weapons. Meaning your dreadlord will be attacking at S4. If they are in a weak unit, you can kill them with combat resolution if your WE slam in its flank (front might work as well but I am not that sure as you would not have *that* many attacks and the lord can kill a lot). If not, an extremely sturdy dreadlord might survive a few rounds of combat with him (4++, dawnstone, glittering scales, something like this). Then, another unit can hit the flank and destroy it with CR again. Or you can just shoot them down.

He is likely to bring the Book of Arkhan which contains the movement spell that also grants rerolls to hit and heals a friendly character. His healing will still be worse than normal but good enough to keep the lord going for quite a while.

Sisters can handle almost anything in his army. However, they can NOT handle the lord or a unit of knights. 2+ armour is a pain.

Maybe bring four bolt throwers. They are very good against terrorgheists and can help against vargheists, black knights and such quite a lot, too.

One more idea: maybe bring the frog scroll. You *know* the vampire is going to be a lvl1. And he is quite likely to try to cast anyway, for healing or getting additional movement.

P.S.: and if you are looking for pre-battle advice, it would help if you post it a bit sooner. :) More time to write an answer or actually to notice the post at all. :)

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Tue May 26, 2015 3:58 pm
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Thanks for the feedback !

5 victory points can be earned by
- opening the tower
- freed caster alive and not fleeing at the end of battle
- killing enemy freed character

1 victory point per destroyed / fled enemy unit

All units can be attacked with normal weapons (so ethereals can be hurt with normal shooting / melee) as long as the tower is closed.

Haha the idea about the frog scroll is amazing. Imagine his Vampire Lord on Coven Throne worth 450 points casting it first spell and turned into a frog hehe.

Battle plan :

Witchstar (ghouls) + flanking normal Gladiators take one flank, while flaming Gladiators and Dragon (black knights) take another. Ofcourse all as close to the tower as possible. Shades prevent his vanguarding so that my own Dark Riders can vanguard towards the tower. Therefore I should have four units in base contact with the tower before the battle starts. Reapers are divided into the rear corners for crossed artillery fire.

If I get first turn, dark riders move up to double flee his Crypt Horrors, both shades and lone sorceress base contact with the tower while rest of the army advances for next turn charges. If he gets first turn and charges my Dark Riders I flee (except for Direwolfs which is stand & shoot) and hopefully Shades can be difficult to reach to place them as far as possible to my side base contact with the tower.

Battleplan
Image

He might underestimate the Druchii Gladiators as last Warrior of Chaos player did (I also seem to have above average luck with them because they are just so cool) and charge them with fast units like vargheists and varghulf which means certain death for them.

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Wed May 27, 2015 2:53 pm
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First of all, a hundred ships full of slaves is send to the Lost Colony. Cunning general Marchosias tip to bring an Frog Scroll against the enemey Vampire Lord who had to be an lvl 1 won me the game in a typical Druchii way. For more information about the scenario check the posts above.

Magic
Vampire Lord : Signature
Sorceress : Shems Gaze

Deployment

I deploy my dark riders in the centre, Witchstar opposide his Crypt Ghouls and both Druchii Gladiators flank the Witchstar. Lord Drakon deploys on the left flank opposing his Crypt Horrors, Terrorgheist, Vargheists and Vampire Lord. My Shades deploy at the Tower of Annullment in the centre to block enemy vanguards.

Vanguarding sees my dark riders move up towards the tower in the centre. We roll for the dice of dices, and the opponents gets the first turn !

Image

Vampire Counts Turn 1

The enemy Crypt Horrors charge the left Dark Riders who flee. The rest of the army advances. His dire wolfs and varghulf make base contact with the Tower to open it. Black Knights move up and same for Vargheists who threaten my Reaper Bolt Throwers for a turn 2 charge (and just out of sight of Lord Drakon).

As there is no magic phase (it was 2D6 - 6 power dice) and nothing in range of Terrorgheist the enemy rolls 2 dice to open the tower, but fails to roll an 1.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 1

A little surprised by the fast advance of the enemy, Lord Drakon sees an opportunity at the small frontage of the Dire Wolfs at the tower and possible overrun into Terrorgheist (this was a mistake, as overrun would lead into Horrors only). Both Druchii Gladiators squads move up, same for Witchstar for a turn 2 charge. Dark Riders rally and block enemy Black Knights and one unit of Shades advances at the right flank. Sorceress makes base contact with the Tower so three units touch it. Other dark riders don't really know what to do so take the centre to shoot Vargheists.

Combined RBT fire inflict two wounds on the Vargheists, and a skills Dark Riders inflict another, killing one. Shades kill two skeletons just for fun.

For the first time I would see how Lord Drakon would behave on his mighty Dragon. They kill the Dire Wolfs easily and overrun into the Crypt Horrors. While the enemy sees a juicy flank for his might Vampire Lord, he is unaware of the sneaky scroll my Sorceress brought with her. At the end of the turn I roll three dice to see if I open the tower.. and two 1's ! I free an Master Necromancer with the Lore of Undead !

Image

Vampire Counts Turn 2
The Black Knights charge my Dark Riders, who flee but he catches them ! Vargheists charge the first RBT and easily make it. Crypt Ghouls and Skeletons move up for second turn charge, and Varghulf position himself for counter-charge. Terrorgheist moves behind building to shoot at the freed Necromancer and Vampire Lord position himself to flank charge Lord Drakon (hehehe)

Enemy has power dice but doesn't cast any spell. I am afraid he is aware something cunning is planned by the Druchii forces. Terrorgeist kills off the Necromancer :(

Lord Drakon aims his might lance towards an Crypt Horror and kills it outright. The the Dragon inflict two wounds with his flaming breath (does the enemy lose regenerate for the rest of dragon attacks or not?) and inflict another two with its mighty claws. Another three vanish because of combat resolution and only 1 is left. Wow this guy can kill !! RBT crew kill another vargheist (lol whut !!) but is killed in return and Vargheists overrun off the table.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 2
Witchstar charges the enemy Crypt Ghouls, something prevents Flaming Gladiator Squad to charge his Skeletons and other Gladiator Squad reforms as there is no combat they can reach. Shades garisson the Tower and rest shuffles around. Sorceress move up the hill to cast an 2D6 strengh 6 fire ball on the Terrorgheist. Dark Riders charge fell bats but fail.

Sorceress cast Shems Gaze with 6 dice with casting amount of 25, while enemy only rolls 24. A lot of hits, but only 2 wounds. Shooting kill two Black Knights and some more Skeletons.

Lord Drakon, a little afraid the enemy would not use any magic next turn started to become afraid the plan would fail and he would be turned to dust very easily, so misses all his attacks, dragon inflict 1 wound and Crypt Horror also inflict 1 making it a draw. Then we turn to the Witch versus Ghoul battle. I start rolling, and rolling, and re-rolling and some more re-rolling and 25 Crypt Ghouls are gone... Oh My God.. these witches combined with a COB (especially DH with Ogre Blade and Rune of Khaine) KILL things ! Ghouls kill 6 witches, but are turned to dust and the Witchstar overruns into the Varghulf.

Image

Vampire Counts Turn 3

Lord Drakon prepares himself and drinks the potion of Strength. Annoyed by the total annihilation of his Crypt Ghouls and Horrors, his Vampire Lord smash into the flank of Lord Drakon. Black Knights try to charge the Witchstar but fails. Terrorgheist moves behind combat to Scream Lord Drakon to death even before combat begins. The rest of army was not able to inflict any pain, the Vargheists returned for a turn 4 charge on the far RBT and Skeletons.

Magic (tum dum tum duum) and the enemy rolled 8 vs 4. I hoped for the best.. Then he casted a healing spell with his Vampire Lord !!! and I use my Hex Scroll ! The enemy fails to roll a 1, and the best generic combat character in the game is transformed into a slimy frog ! Hahaha !eek! As you can imagine, the opponent was not happy at all. All credits to Marchosias who suggested this sneaky trick. His Terrorgheist is healed back up and I dispell his other spell with the Throne. Terrorgheist screams in anger at Lord Drakon but his LD 9 (10 - 1) prevents the Dragon from being killed and only get 2 wounds.

I did not had any models of a frog so I brought this small goblin snotling in case it worked. Here the transformation into frog/snotling !
Image

In combat the Hag and Witches easily kill the Varghulf before it gets to attack. Then the main combat who would decide the battle. Lord Drakon challenge the toadlord and aims his sword at the very angry frog, and easily kills it. The Dragon inflict another two wounds on the Coven, who fails to inflict any wound. Because of the death of the general, the last crypt horror dies, the two fell bats die and some skeletons die. At this point we both know that I have won the battle, but as it is for the local tourney they enemy hopes to secure a 4 - 1 instead of a 5 - 0 by keeping 1 unit alive.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 3

Flaming Gladiator Squad finally sees combat and brave Shades flank the Skeletons. Other Gladiators move for countercharge of the Black Knights. Sorceress runs far from the Terrorgheist to fire another fire ball.

Sorceress throws another Shems gaze at Terrorgheist with 6 dice and gets IR. Miscast sees her lose her D3 levels of magic and she becomes an ordinary check on a horse. Shems Gaze inflict three wounds on the Terrorgheist. One moment of applause for this 140 point level 1 sorceress who turned a 650 point model into a friggin frog. She actually won the battle. Not only turning the best character of the Warhammer world into a frog, she inflicted 5 wounds on the terrorgheist, more than my total shooting was able to do. Shooting kills off some Black Knigts.

Lord Drakon + Dragon kill the Coven Throne. Druchii Gladiators show again why they are awesome by killing 11 skeletons, Shades kill another 4, turning the total Skeleton battalion into dust as like they never existed. End of turn the Terrorgheist dies because of dead general, Black Knights also lose 1.

Image

Vampire Counts Turn 4

Black Knights charge only good target, Shades in building. Vargheists charge lone RBT. RBT is killed and Vargheists run off the table, Shades kill two knights while knights also kill 2 shades.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 4

Gladiators who had not seen combat so far charge the Black Knights in the flank, rest of the army moves up to hunt the last Vargheists when they come back on the table. Gladiators inflict 6 wounds, and enemy fails 2 armour saves so is dead.

Image

Vampire Counts Turn 5

Vargheists come back and know they are surrounded. No escape possible.

Image

Dark Elves Turn 5

Lord Drakon and Dark Riders charge the last two Vargheists to secure a 5 - 0 victory for the Dark Elves.

Image

The plan could have failed if the enemy had not casted a spell, but because of the wounded Terrorgheist I also forced him to do it. If the frog plan had not worked Lord Drakon would have been turned to ashes, making it impossible to get the 5 - 0 victory, but it worked so a great comeback for the Dark Elves in the local tourney. Next scenario battle is against Skaven in Loot & Pillage and this saturday I have another battle against Skaven player to get some practise with the new list.

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