Musing with the Will of Gods: wacky legal formations

[Calisson]

Gods ordered that a Cauldron of Blood or a Bloodwrack Shrine (further referred as "chariot") could join a unit,
but had to be placed in the centre of the first rank.

With a quick reading, one could believe that the combined unit would be rather symmetric on each sides of the chariot.
I wonder here to which point could the Will of Gods be twisted?

-=-=-

Let's first recall the rules.
1. Footprint.
The chariot takes the space of 3x5 infantry models.
Most often, there will be less than 5 ranks, and the rear of the chariot will emerge proeminently from the back of the unit.

2. Odd number of columns on each side.
As the chariot takes room for three columns, if the formation has an even number of columns, that leaves an odd number of columns for the unit, which is necessarily asymmetric.
Note that the "centre" of an even number of columns is defined nowhere except p.77, "skirmishers and charging" which specifies that either centremost models can be chosen as the centre. With that in mind, it is safe to consider that the chariot is in the centre when there is no more than one column difference between the two sides.

3. Incomplete ranks.
Forming units p.5 tells us that only the last rank may have less models.
This page does not tell anything about how to place the missing / extra models.
Actually, p.49 shows examples where the extra models are on a side or in the middle of the mostly empty rank.

4. Several incomplete ranks.
P.5 tells us that:
- as far as possible there must be the same number of models in each rank.
- the rear rank must be the one that has fewer models.
Thanks to the chariot, we will discover cases where there are some ranks that have various number of models, between the rear rank that always has the fewer, and the front rank that always has the most.
Yes, it is legal, as the rule "same model in each rank" is only "as far as possible.

5. Other characters.
The unit may well receive other characters in addition to the chariot.
It could be a 2x2 pegasus mounted character. Who would be inserted inside the unit, too.
I do not consider a cavalry or dragon footprint, which would collide and be placed as specified BRB p.98, on either edge. No particular fun.

-=-=-

Now, the fun part: wacky examples.
In all examples, X is an infantryman, the 15 C represent the chariot, four P represent a pegasus.
In all examples, the combined unit faces left.

- "I" shape
3 columns, chariot alone in the middle of nobody, everybody behind. Zero full rank, but everyone is safe behind. Best done with stubborn BG escorting a precious character.

C C C C C X X
C C C C C X X X
C C C C C X X

- "D" shape.
This shape is perfect to demonstrate that there could be several incomplete ranks, not only the rear one.

X X X
X X X X
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X X X X
X X X

- "E" shape.
Not only it is legal, but it is mandatory if the "D shape" unit was attacked on both sides.
(EDIT: the legality of that formation is questionable. See comment below.)

X X X X
X X X
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X X X
X X X X

- "T" shape.
Probably the most often seen, after the previous one has been depleted.

X
X
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X
X

- "P" shape, or 80% / 20%
Reducing the combined unit to 6 columns, a 5 "X" unit could well be spread out 80% on one side, 20% on the other side.
Note that if the unit is charged on the right side, it is possible to overkill the single X, resulting in death across the chariot!

X
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X X
X X

- The "united we stand" formation
Let's have a peggy character join the fun!
Joining the previous "T" shape results in having the whole initial unit reunited back into a single block!

P P
P P
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X X
X X

- The "podium" shape.
In the previous example, if the full command was there, the peggy would be pushed in the rear because three X must remain in the front!
That makes an odd formation, with one side having the triple length of the other side.

X P P
X P P
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X
X

- The "1,2,3,5" shape.
An assassin pops into the the previous one.
It makes a very irregular rear, with 4 different lengths for 7 columns.

X P P
X P P
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X X
X

- 6 models, 5 ranks
Two peggy characters and a chariot join a depleted unit, of which remains only the 3 command group. They make 6 columns.
Of course, the peggies can only go on the same side. And the command group must go in the front.
You've got five full ranks!

X P P P P
X P P P P
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
X

- kill one infantryman, lose two ranks
In the previous formation, one X killed leaves two X, who still need to be in the first rank. As the chariot still needs to be in the centre, one peggy must go and fill the gap.
Only 3 ranks left, that's two ranks lost and one column gained because of a single casualty.

X P P
X P P
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
P P
P P

- kill one infantryman, gain two ranks
In the previous formation, one more X killed leaves one last X, who still needs to be in the first rank. The peggy can no longer remain behind a single infantryman.
But there's some room behind the other peggy! And the unit goes back to 4 full ranks, gaining one rank when one model was killed.

X
C C C C C
C C C C C
C C C C C
P P P P
P P P P

Note that this "4 models, 4 ranks" formation can be made with characters only.
2 peggies, 1 infantry character, one chariot.

- kill one infantryman, lose four ranks.
If the last infantryman is killed, the chariot finds itself inside a unit of pegasi.
But a character cannot join a unit of flyers (BRB p.97).
Therefore, the unit must be disbanded and the chariot and the two pegasi become three individual units - with zero full rank.

[Daeron]

I had a good laugh with this. Indeed, some oddities can arrise with a chariot like this in the middle. I only have a remark about the E formation. It may be mandatory in combat, but I think outside combat, the models must be placed together (so both X's of the final rank together). This is the recommendation of pg5 I think.

[Calisson]

You're absolutely right with a strict reading of rules.
I considered that my "dotted lines" would qualify as lines", but it might be pushing the rules too far.

I like the idea of a '4 models' character-only formation.
Displaying 4 ranks of characters in a 1500 pts game is priceless!

[Daeron]

You could even throw a peggy on each side of the BWS/COB, have a unit of blackguards back that up and make the whole unit stubborn. Some nasty things can be done here

[Amboadine]

You could even throw a peggy on each side of the BWS/COB, have a unit of blackguards back that up and make the whole unit stubborn.

That is a nasty setup. Almost tempts me to re-base my Pegs onto 40mm just for the sheer look on my opponents face.

@Calisson, some nice analysis on the potential foot prints. Thanks, opened my eyes to some interesting tactical tricks.

[Dalamar]

Three peg masters and 12bg... through the proactive use of make way, the unit has to be attacked from two sides for any bg to be attackable.

And your pegs should be on 40mm bases.

[Amboadine]

I would disagree, my Morathi came on a 50x50 and as that is the only Dark peg model currently available that is what I am basing my sizing on. There is a difference between a pegasus and dark pegasus. But there are already threads discussing that as I know Morathi has in the past also come with a 40x40.

[Dalamar]

Currently morathi comes on a 40mm base. She has been on it since 6th edition. Barring packaging error, that's what you should have.

[Amboadine]

Strange, my finecast came with 50mm, last year.
I will pop down the local store and take a look at which base is in the pack now.

[marcopollo]

Also of interest is that cavalry models are 2.5 infantry long. So two ranks of cavalry equal the entire length of the chariot. This does pose a problem when counting files. 2 cav models wide is 2.5 infantry wide. Not exactly the 3 models wide that the chariot is. Add another cav model and you've got 3.75 infantry models (bigger than the chariot).

So for example you could have the chariot join a depleted unit of cold ones and have two full ranks with only 6 cavalry models. Managing full command would also help protect a vulnerable character.

[Dalamar]

Chariot will never add to rank bonus of a cavalry unit regardless of its position due to mismatched bases.

[dms505]

Ina recent game I had Black guard and a SS against a unit of 3 knights and ended up reforming like this due to full command and never worrying about ranks due to stubborn. Didn't really take long to chew up 3 knights but I wanted to protect my right flank using the cauldron and SS using command models. You can still do 5-6 wide and keep soft characters in the second row with the cauldron/shrine which I like.


GCCC
GCCC
GCCC
SCCC
GCCC
GCCC
GGGG
GGGG

[Gidean]

Currently morathi comes on a 40mm base. She has been on it since 6th edition. Barring packaging error, that's what you should have.

I don't want to derail this topic but it is relevant to what Calisson posted. Amboadine is correct Dalamar. For some stupid reason when GW went to Finecrap they packaged not only Morathi but Great Eagles on 50mm bases. No idea why. So if you use the strict rule in the book (base supplied) those newer models would be on 50mm. But for those of us who own the old Morathi we can use the 40mm base.

I wish GW could simple state under every unit type, the proper base size. It would make life so much easier for us Warhammer nerds.

So how is it relevant? It affects his cauldron positioning examples. Because Dark Pegs on 50mm would simple be put front rank and to the side of a unit (having no effect on any back ranks of troops).