Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
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Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
So comming Saturday i have a 1k doubles match comming up. im bringing a DE army and my teammate TK with a Casket of Souls and now... something hit me.
The wording of Shroud of Despair says that "any kind of failed Ld test" gives -1Ld to all units affected by SoD... and from memory the Caskets Bound Spell is a Ld test on 3D6.
So.... wouldn't that allow for one evil badass combo where with a bit of planning you can eat a hefty chunk out of the enemy army with a good magic phase?
The wording of Shroud of Despair says that "any kind of failed Ld test" gives -1Ld to all units affected by SoD... and from memory the Caskets Bound Spell is a Ld test on 3D6.
So.... wouldn't that allow for one evil badass combo where with a bit of planning you can eat a hefty chunk out of the enemy army with a good magic phase?
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
You roll against Ld, but I don't think it's actually a Ld test since it's not a pass/fail situation but a take damage or not situation. I don't have the exact wording for the Casket rule though.
"The dark elves have everything cool. They are pirate blood cultist ninjas riding dinosaurs and flinging magic. They're metal. They're the most metal race out there, rivaled only by Warriors of Chaos. They bring a cauldron of boiling blood onto the battlefield. You don't get much more metal than that." -- Mostlyharmless on Warseer
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Yeah that is what im afraid off. but my mate doesn't have his book at hand either so wondered if some1 here might know
EDIT:
so my friend just send me the exact wording of the Light of Death spell and it goes
"The target of Light of Death must make a Leadership Test on 3D6 adding the results together."
in the following lines it even talks about Passing and Failing the test.
So... that would mean that when combo'd right... this can destroy an armies Ld very fast
EDIT:
so my friend just send me the exact wording of the Light of Death spell and it goes
"The target of Light of Death must make a Leadership Test on 3D6 adding the results together."
in the following lines it even talks about Passing and Failing the test.
So... that would mean that when combo'd right... this can destroy an armies Ld very fast
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Actually, I take it back. The Light of Death bound spell explicitly calls it a Leadership Test. So yeah, it would synergize with Shroud in both that the unit couldn't use the General's Ld, nor a BSB reroll. And to top it off, there's the cumulative -1 once it fails.
EDIT: Relevant text: "The target of Light of Death must take a Leadership test on 3D6, adding the results together. If the test is passed, nothign happens. Otherwise, for each point the unit failed the test by, the unit suffers an automatic wound with no armor saves allowed, distributed as for shooting attacks."
Shroud: "... whenever a target fails a Leadership test of any kind, ..."
EDIT: Relevant text: "The target of Light of Death must take a Leadership test on 3D6, adding the results together. If the test is passed, nothign happens. Otherwise, for each point the unit failed the test by, the unit suffers an automatic wound with no armor saves allowed, distributed as for shooting attacks."
Shroud: "... whenever a target fails a Leadership test of any kind, ..."
"The dark elves have everything cool. They are pirate blood cultist ninjas riding dinosaurs and flinging magic. They're metal. They're the most metal race out there, rivaled only by Warriors of Chaos. They bring a cauldron of boiling blood onto the battlefield. You don't get much more metal than that." -- Mostlyharmless on Warseer
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
If you are in a Doubles Tournament looks like TK might be a good choice of partner ...
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
TK has core chariots, reasonable artillery, and strong magic. Toss in a few badass monsters and the option for MC, and you got yourself something that compliments DE rather well.
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Class: Mage (Pyromancer)
Equipment: Staff, longsword, dagger, 20 gold, insignia ring.
Skills: Power of Aqshy (2), defensive figthing
WS4, S2, T3, D4, I6.
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
The Casket is horrible to face at the best of times.
Live in fear of this combo!
Live in fear of this combo!
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
So I got my friend thus far to agree on this plan
I'll let you guys know how it works and wether or not we'll get kicked from the Tourny or not
I'll let you guys know how it works and wether or not we'll get kicked from the Tourny or not
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Let's see, cumulative -1 for each failed test on 3d6, -1 for each failed panic afterwards... -1 for each failed rally test... This is scary.
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)
8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)
8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16
Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Just to pile it on... have him wait until you have a BWS near the unit.
"The dark elves have everything cool. They are pirate blood cultist ninjas riding dinosaurs and flinging magic. They're metal. They're the most metal race out there, rivaled only by Warriors of Chaos. They bring a cauldron of boiling blood onto the battlefield. You don't get much more metal than that." -- Mostlyharmless on Warseer
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Dragon9 wrote:Just to pile it on... have him wait until you have a BWS near the unit.
...and a K-Beast in CC with it
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Ow My God! Thats it! Thats the punch I've been missing!
Mmh... will force me to drop my Warlocks tho as its only a 1k doubles...
But might be worth it
Or a Kharibdyss... the decisions
Mmh... will force me to drop my Warlocks tho as its only a 1k doubles...
But might be worth it
Or a Kharibdyss... the decisions
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
This looks brutal, although it will require good positioning, a bit of luck, and excellent timing to pull it off properly for maximum effect.
In an allied game, it's almost certain that we'd be splitting the power and dispel dice from turn one onwards. Although the Casket can more or less power itself, this combination requires two spells to go off perfectly, with optimal field positions for both the targets and the DE caster. We also need to guarantee access to Shroud (which we can), but that probably creates a hole in our magical defences in a 1000-point army.
Please don't read the above as a criticism of the tactic - I think it's an excellent idea. I just note that there are plenty of points of potential failure, and these need to be overcome in delivering the "Casket of Despair" strategy.
In an allied game, it's almost certain that we'd be splitting the power and dispel dice from turn one onwards. Although the Casket can more or less power itself, this combination requires two spells to go off perfectly, with optimal field positions for both the targets and the DE caster. We also need to guarantee access to Shroud (which we can), but that probably creates a hole in our magical defences in a 1000-point army.
Please don't read the above as a criticism of the tactic - I think it's an excellent idea. I just note that there are plenty of points of potential failure, and these need to be overcome in delivering the "Casket of Despair" strategy.
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
To make it work you will need to guarantee shroud (time of furion) mobility to get in optimal position (Pegasus, or dark steed if points are tight) and protection (cloak of twilight)
That means supreme sorceress.
Since you will want to maximize the effectiveness of the combo, you will want to cause as many LD tests as possible so I would only take units capable of shooting. And units capable of causing leadership tests.
So a gunline with 4 reapers and coks/kbeast for countercharge.
Your tomb king buddy should arm himself similarly with screaming skull catapults (with for skulls for extra ding on LD)
Then you can top it off with cheap redirectors... And I think tomb swarms would be cheapest from everything available to both of you.
I wouldn't go to a tournament with this setup expecting to win though, it's far too gimmicky. I would go to have fun and hope to pull this trick off at least once... It would be material for a battle story for years to come. "Remember that one game where we made an entire enemy army flee off the board on turn 1?"
That means supreme sorceress.
Since you will want to maximize the effectiveness of the combo, you will want to cause as many LD tests as possible so I would only take units capable of shooting. And units capable of causing leadership tests.
So a gunline with 4 reapers and coks/kbeast for countercharge.
Your tomb king buddy should arm himself similarly with screaming skull catapults (with for skulls for extra ding on LD)
Then you can top it off with cheap redirectors... And I think tomb swarms would be cheapest from everything available to both of you.
I wouldn't go to a tournament with this setup expecting to win though, it's far too gimmicky. I would go to have fun and hope to pull this trick off at least once... It would be material for a battle story for years to come. "Remember that one game where we made an entire enemy army flee off the board on turn 1?"
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)
8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)
8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
sadly a Supreme will simply cost to much for a 1K army (SS+CoT+ToF=260 and then she still needs a mount) so far i have building my entire army around this idea 'in the back of my head'
Lvl 2 Sorcs, Tome of Furion, Opal Amulet, Dark Pegasus
28 AHW Corsairs, FC, Gleaming Pendant
5 Cold One Knights
2 RBT's
1 Kharibdyss
comes in at 998 points ad should give me some fighting power
Lvl 2 Sorcs, Tome of Furion, Opal Amulet, Dark Pegasus
28 AHW Corsairs, FC, Gleaming Pendant
5 Cold One Knights
2 RBT's
1 Kharibdyss
comes in at 998 points ad should give me some fighting power
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
- Searinox Nagharha
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
so a quick recap on my tournament day and the standing of it all. Lets get something straight first... we lost big time xD ended second to last (hey, atleast its not last ) still, we had a great time doing it.
Battle one
vs Orcs&Goblins with Deamons of Chaos
now our enemy had Festus and we basicly stood no chance (my mate came to the conclusion that he only made one mistake during the entire day... that he brought TK xD) the O&C player wasnt a big deal and once i got my Peggy Sorc into place between his huge Goblin Block, Rock Lobba and Doom Diver i was able to hit all of em with Shroud of Despair(sadly the casket had died by this point) Rolling 3 5's on the cast resulting in 1 destroyed DoomDiver, which caused the Rock Lobba to fail its panic check (yay).
then after my Corsairs caused another Fear check (fear for elves) I won combat and he needed to check on -2 Ld
he made it... but the look on this guy face when he saw his Ld drop and his BsB roll dissapear... Priceless
Battle Two
vs Orge Kingdom with Dwarves
now we at first we didn't plan on trying the combo here but eventually we decided to go for it. (they had lots of shooting)
so after alot of dancing around with my Sorc I was finnaly able to get her into a nice position where i was able to hit 2 dwarf units and an Ogre unit. at this point we found out about Dwarfs insanely high Ld but it still worked well.
hitting the dwarf unit, did 3 wounds, failed Ld check, -1 Ld
jumped to Ogre unit, did 6 wounds, failed Ld check, -2 Ld
jumped to Dwarves, did 5 wounds, failed Ld check, -3 Ld
the look on their faces when this combo hit and destroyed 8 dwarves and 2 ogres... Priceless
Battle Three (the best one)
Orcs&Goblins with Chaos Dwarves
again, lots of shooting so didnt get my Sorc in place before turn 3, when i did i was able to hit 2 Chaos Dwarf Warmachines, a Chaos Dwarf combat block, goblin block and a unit of Trolls (i was way to happy about the last one )
then the casket came through, 1 warmachine, -1 Ld
jumped to the next, killing it, we are at -2 Ld now
jumped to the unit of Chaos Dwarves, did 5 Wounds, we're at -3 Ld now
then hit the Goblins, doing a good 7 wounds, sitting at a nice -4 Ld now
now the fun part, it jumps to the Trolls! with them sitting at a nice Ld1 now it destroys half the unit and leaves me and my buddy with a nasty smile on our faces as the enemies faces turned whiter with each failed Ld check
next turn my m8 charges his Warsphynx into the goblins who flee off the table.
(personal victory for myself, first time my Kharibdyss made Close Combat and the Reroll succesfull tests made the Chaos Dwarves reroll both the Fear check to fail it on the second roll and the Break test also failing it on the second roll)
all in all it was an insanely fun but to quote a certain group of jackasses
"That was fun. Let's Never do that again."
Battle one
vs Orcs&Goblins with Deamons of Chaos
now our enemy had Festus and we basicly stood no chance (my mate came to the conclusion that he only made one mistake during the entire day... that he brought TK xD) the O&C player wasnt a big deal and once i got my Peggy Sorc into place between his huge Goblin Block, Rock Lobba and Doom Diver i was able to hit all of em with Shroud of Despair(sadly the casket had died by this point) Rolling 3 5's on the cast resulting in 1 destroyed DoomDiver, which caused the Rock Lobba to fail its panic check (yay).
then after my Corsairs caused another Fear check (fear for elves) I won combat and he needed to check on -2 Ld
he made it... but the look on this guy face when he saw his Ld drop and his BsB roll dissapear... Priceless
Battle Two
vs Orge Kingdom with Dwarves
now we at first we didn't plan on trying the combo here but eventually we decided to go for it. (they had lots of shooting)
so after alot of dancing around with my Sorc I was finnaly able to get her into a nice position where i was able to hit 2 dwarf units and an Ogre unit. at this point we found out about Dwarfs insanely high Ld but it still worked well.
hitting the dwarf unit, did 3 wounds, failed Ld check, -1 Ld
jumped to Ogre unit, did 6 wounds, failed Ld check, -2 Ld
jumped to Dwarves, did 5 wounds, failed Ld check, -3 Ld
the look on their faces when this combo hit and destroyed 8 dwarves and 2 ogres... Priceless
Battle Three (the best one)
Orcs&Goblins with Chaos Dwarves
again, lots of shooting so didnt get my Sorc in place before turn 3, when i did i was able to hit 2 Chaos Dwarf Warmachines, a Chaos Dwarf combat block, goblin block and a unit of Trolls (i was way to happy about the last one )
then the casket came through, 1 warmachine, -1 Ld
jumped to the next, killing it, we are at -2 Ld now
jumped to the unit of Chaos Dwarves, did 5 Wounds, we're at -3 Ld now
then hit the Goblins, doing a good 7 wounds, sitting at a nice -4 Ld now
now the fun part, it jumps to the Trolls! with them sitting at a nice Ld1 now it destroys half the unit and leaves me and my buddy with a nasty smile on our faces as the enemies faces turned whiter with each failed Ld check
next turn my m8 charges his Warsphynx into the goblins who flee off the table.
(personal victory for myself, first time my Kharibdyss made Close Combat and the Reroll succesfull tests made the Chaos Dwarves reroll both the Fear check to fail it on the second roll and the Break test also failing it on the second roll)
all in all it was an insanely fun but to quote a certain group of jackasses
"That was fun. Let's Never do that again."
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Searinox Nagharha wrote:... we lost big time xD ended second to last (hey, atleast its not last )
Commiserations on the defeat...
Searinox Nagharha wrote:then the casket came through, 1 warmachine, -1 Ld
jumped to the next, killing it, we are at -2 Ld now
jumped to the unit of Chaos Dwarves, did 5 Wounds, we're at -3 Ld now
then hit the Goblins, doing a good 7 wounds, sitting at a nice -4 Ld now
now the fun part, it jumps to the Trolls! with them sitting at a nice Ld1 now it destroys half the unit and leaves me and my buddy with a nasty smile on our faces as the enemies faces turned whiter with each failed Ld check
...but in my eyes it was worth it!
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
This is so cool you were able to pull it off.
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Re: Shroud of Despair + Casket of Souls = Madness?
Ow yes it was definatly worth it. Not only that, but it gave me a new love for Shroud of Despair.
I always looked at it with a bit of disdane i would say, nvr rly thinking much of it.
But to see the damage simply taking away Inspuring Pressence or BSB rerolls can do to an army rly gave me a new love for the spell.
Tho Shadow is still very dear to my heart aswell so having to pick now between lores rly hurts me
as its hard to choose
I always looked at it with a bit of disdane i would say, nvr rly thinking much of it.
But to see the damage simply taking away Inspuring Pressence or BSB rerolls can do to an army rly gave me a new love for the spell.
Tho Shadow is still very dear to my heart aswell so having to pick now between lores rly hurts me
as its hard to choose
PLOG - The House of Corvus
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth
Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth