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Things to watch out for in 7th 
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Highborn
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Hey all,

I had a few games today, and I came across a friend of mine's sacred host of Quetzl. This let him take the Lore of Death, and he managed to roll Doom and Darkness for two of his mages. Little did I know, D&D works against *ALL* LD based tests- including stupidity. As I hadn't taken a Sorceress in this game (I had decided to try dropping her for a unit of CoK's and we were only playing 1k), and he was running 3 Skink priests, this allowd him to totally dominate me by making my Chariots and CoK's test on ld 5 and 6, respectively. Definately something I didn't expect.

I'm just making this post to warn other players to look out for this incredibly destructive spell- as the majority of our hammers have the disadvantage of having stupidity.

I'd also ask that other players post anything they've come up against that is especially vulnerble to Dark Elves so we as a community can attempt to come up with ideas to get around these vulnerabilties.


Fri Nov 03, 2006 2:53 pm
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Dark Rider

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Ouch! What a nasty way of using that spell :shock:. I can't think of any special weeknesses that i've encoutered with 7th edition for Dark elves. I was just wondering; does Doom and Darkness reduce Ld for break tests as well?

Storm.

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Fri Nov 03, 2006 3:48 pm
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Adept of Khaine
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Never thought of that... I'll have to keep my eye out for it! I don't play against armies using Death much, but when I use death on my soceress, I'll keep this spell in mind!

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Fri Nov 03, 2006 3:51 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend
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Sorceress with a unit of 15 crossbowmen in a building? Shes safe right?

WRONG!

When the enemy assaults the building he can dedicate up to 5 of his 10 attacking models to attacking one character. For this reason you precious sorceress is highly likely to be killed by the weakest of assaulting troops.

KEEP YOUR SORCERESSES OUT OF BUILDINGS - THEY DONT LIKE IT!


Fri Nov 03, 2006 4:25 pm
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Highborn
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@ Venkh,

Ouch... I never knew that- I think I need to re-read some of the more obscure sections of my rulebook.

I've had a lot of success recently just put 5-10 Shades by themselves in there. There 70-140 pts, so not enough to actually go after, but they are practically immune to being shot out of there, and are great at contesting/capturing a quarter and march blocking while still getting 10shots per level.

@ Storm,

It affects it for *ALL* LD based tests, so yes, that includes Break tests. I love it when I roll that spell- but seriously, 3 Skink Priests in 1000pts is bad enough when they take Heavens. Death is just plain evil, even without the ability to completely screw our strongest hammer units.


Fri Nov 03, 2006 4:32 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard

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Storm wrote:
I was just wondering; does Doom and Darkness reduce Ld for break tests as well?


I do believe that's just about the most comon use for it.


Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:12 pm
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Beastmaster

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Dam that bad for a cold one knights ,chariots .I hope no one try that against me where i play


Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:21 pm
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Lord of the Dragon Caves
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Here's something -- pay attention to the Panic rules. I was playing it wrong for a little while, thinking that things were similar to 6th edition.

Specifically, you do NOT take a panic test at the beginning of the turn for fleeing friends being nearby. That was something you had to do in 6th Edition, but not 7th.

Playing it wrong cost me a reaper bolt-thrower in my game against Ras in London last month ;)

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Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:05 pm
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Dyvim Tvar wrote:
Here's something -- pay attention to the Panic rules. I was playing it wrong for a little while, thinking that things were similar to 6th edition.

Specifically, you do NOT take a panic test at the beginning of the turn for fleeing friends being nearby. That was something you had to do in 6th Edition, but not 7th.

Playing it wrong cost me a reaper bolt-thrower in my game against Ras in London last month ;)


so when do you take that panic test?


Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:20 pm
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M-A-D
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Frank: You don't.

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Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:25 pm
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RasputinII wrote:
Frank: You don't.


I see only if they go through them .


Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:28 pm
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Lord of the Dragon Caves
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There are more limited circumstances for taking panic tests now. If I recall correctly, they are:

1) Unit takes 25% casulaties from shooting, magic, or other miscelaneous non-combat stuff

2) Fleeing friends of US5 or more flee through the unit

3) Unit is near a combat in which a friendly unit breaks or is wiped out

4) Unit is near a friendly unit that gets completely destroyed by magic, missiles, etc.

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Fri Nov 03, 2006 10:05 pm
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D&D is a nasty spell. however, he still has to roll high to get it off and you have a chance to dispel it during your casting phase. Unfortunately, if it does go off you have to suffer at least 1 round of low LD for stupidity.

3 priests as a host of quetzel? man, that is one expensive host. I play LM and have toyed with all the hosts during our 500 pt leagues and three priests does not leave a lot of points left. at 1000 pts, I can't remember, does he have 3 hero slots or 4? if only three and he takes 3 then his generals leadership is only the skink 5 I believe. Get those fear checks going...


Wed Nov 08, 2006 4:36 pm
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Cold One Knight
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Watch your harpies too. Flying units don't count as skirmished anymore.

Also, I seem to remember hearing that destroyed warmachines dont cause panic anymore. is this true?

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Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:00 pm
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Beastmaster
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Erm, harpies do count as skirmishers when it comes to shooting. Only flying units WITH human size (harpies, furies...) can benefit from the -1 to shoot.

Other than that they don't get that privilige (better chance of getting rid of those peggies and fell bats with shooting)

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Im not saying that makes them unworthy of a model, Im just saying...that Malekith is the greatest elven king in the history of the world and I will never concede otherwise.


Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:12 pm
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Cold One Knight
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Ah, my mistake. Sorry.

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Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:13 pm
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Lord of the Dragon Caves
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Actually, the rule is that the -1 to hit only applies to skirmishers that have US 1 per model.

So that includes most flying units, regardless of base size. Bat swarms, for example, only have US 1 per base and so they are -1 to hit even though they are on 40mm bases. But there is no penalty to shoot Pegasus Knights since they are US 2 per model.

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Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:24 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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To clarify on Doom and Darkness,
You only get -3 to leadership for stupidity if you already failed your leadership test - that doom and darkness makes you take - that turn.


Wed Nov 08, 2006 11:09 pm
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doom and darkness works for several turns

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Thu Nov 09, 2006 3:11 am
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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Doom and Darkness works for 1 turn, and at the beginning of your opponents turn units affected by doom and darkness take a LDR test, if they fail it affects them for their turn.

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Thu Nov 09, 2006 3:30 am
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Highborn
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His list, roughly off the top of my head, was:

3 Skink Priests, Lvl 2, Quetzl Sacred Spawning
2x 12(?) Skinks, 1 w/Pipes 1/Javelins, Quetzl Sacred Spawning
18 Saurus, FC, Quetzl Sacred Spawning
3 Kroxigor

I thinkthat was it. Not sure if the Krox can have the spawning or not.

It went something like this.

I do everything I can to stop Doom and Darkness going off with my 3 dice, he gets it off a bit, slowing my Chariots down. My CoK's decide that waiting for the chariots (who keep failing stupidity) is boring, so I rush them up the centre and smash into the front of the Saurus unit, holding them there til the end of the game (I fluffed my charge attacks). My DR's run from Skinks, realise they're screwed and just hide in my Deployment zone holding a quarter.

My spearmen take advantage of his misinterpretation of the 7th rules for 'Enemies in the Way' and charge 1 of his priests that flees, runs into another of his priests, which flees, and then hits the front of the Saurus. One of my chariots also finally hits that unit. My 2nd chariot keeps getting D&D'd, so has now failed 4 stupidity checks in a row.

I roll 1 for Impact Hits, get no kills from everything I had attacking the unit, and concede.

EDIT: Forgot to mention: His skirmishing skinks fight my 5 of my Shades. With HW+Shield (Javelin) + Mark of Quetzl, he gets a 4+ save. It takes a while, but after I kill 7 skinks over 3 turns he wins combat and runs me down.


Thu Nov 09, 2006 3:47 am
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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it seems your biggest problems were dice luck and his skinks. Not much i can do about the dice luck.

Skinks, they are mean little things. However stand and shoot can only target 1 unit. He seems to be using a big unit if you killed 7 and he still won adventually. I suggest charging 2 units. Often 2 DR works best. He will kill one with stand and shoot, if he has a big unit. Then probably loose to the DR. If you use harpies, using them to dual charge with COK is a good option as well. The key is to get 2 units on them. So both the flee and stand and shoot reactions are bad.


Thu Nov 09, 2006 3:58 am
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Dyvim Tvar wrote:
Specifically, you do NOT take a panic test at the beginning of the turn for fleeing friends being nearby. That was something you had to do in 6th Edition, but not 7th.



Yeah, we found that out not that long go, in addition there is also an order to take Terror, stupidity and special start of turn rules, which means that you can still flee in terror before you go stupid. I rather liked the ability to go ItP and ignore the dragon. :P That rule actually won me a game lately.. I tested panic for a LARGE unit of spears w/Sorceress.. I didn't feel right, so I checked the book.. and we put my unit back on the table. :D

Fr0

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Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:40 am
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Cold One Knight
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Not really a 7th thing but Direwolf have just released an updated wood elf FAQ. While most things tone WE down (ie a treeman can't stand and shoot) the moonstone of the hiddenways is now something to watch out for. For those not familiar with it the magic item is one use only and allows a charter and unit to move from within one wood to anywhere else within a wood at the end of the movement phase. In the current FAQ however Direwolf rule that this is any movement phase and even if they are in combat. So you charge my wardancers plus noble while they are in a wood. At the end of your movement phase I move them out of combat and next to your unit for a charge in my turn!

Quite simply put sick! SO avoid charging wardancers plus noble in a wood unless you can force them rank up outside the wood - so rooting them to the spot :D (soory terrible joke, couldn't resist)

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Thu Nov 09, 2006 11:31 am
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Lord of the Venom Sword
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One small thing is the rules for charging warmachines. You now move the crew to the front of the machine as soon as you make the charge reaction (ie before you measure to see if you are in range). This effectively gives a charger an extra inch or so move if he charges a warmachine since you only need to hit the crew.

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Fri Nov 10, 2006 4:26 pm
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