Defeating Alter Kindred Asrai Heroes

Dangerous Beans · Post by **Dangerous Beans** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:47 am

Hiya chaps, I've been playing several games against my old friend who uses Wood Elves. He adapts and changes his playing style and tends to use balanced forces with a mix match of everything.

Recently however he's discovered a really rather nasty Lord combo that Im sure must be used numerously by other Asrai players - essentially his Lord is kitted out with the following:

- Alter Kindred (giving him M9 and +1 A - I'm not sure but I think his initiative is also raised.
- The Bow of Loren a magic bow that works the same as a longbow except that you can shoot as many times as you have attacks and at the strength of the wielder (so S4 for his lord).
- Arcane Bodkins arrows that you can use in magic bows - these ones negate armour saves.
- Unknown Item this is the item that gives its user a 3+ Ward Save vs non-magical attacks: pretty useful really...
- a great weapon and other kit to make him not too shabby in combat + can charge with the great weapon if needs must.

So, the nasty little combo that he's made is excellent against elite expensive units and characters - 5 shots each turn at BS 6 that allow no armour saves is lethal. Then he has a high movement and thus can either move to where he is needed, or very quickly move to another location away from a threat - eg. Dark Riders. If he is caught in the open then he has the 3+ ward save and a good magic defence to keep off anything nasty. He often hides in units and guns down any threat that may harm him - eg. Magic Weapon wielding Nobles on Dark Pegasus etc...

Anyway, my point of this thread is to discuss the methods to combat the highly mobile alter kindred - whether they are the 'mobile fire support' character (like the Lord I have trouble dealing with - any ideas are greatly appreciated!

) or the very fast Combat character - particularly one with Annoyance of Nettlings (or something like that! the one that makes you need 6s to hit in Challenges...)

When I attended the UK university nationals in march there was a wood elf army there with 2 alter kindred heroes zipping around causing all sorts of havok - anyone got any counters?!?!?! lol!

ah, stupid ***** wood elves...

- Beanz

Raneth · Post by **Raneth** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:00 am

Lifetaker.

Dangerous Beans · Post by **Dangerous Beans** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:04 am

Yeah see thats what I'd thought but he tends to interspace bodyguard units for his lord so I can never singularly target him...

its lame lol! I've tried hunting him down through shooting and combat but so far the only thing thats come close is shutting him down through magic and even thats not easy when he takes such a stronge magic defence!

I know that preventing him from making up his points is a moral victory but I really would love the satisfaction of killing the cheeky bugger!

Hmmmm, maybe a Hydra combined with Unseen Lurker is the way to do it?? I think he'd eat the hydra though - 5 St 6 attacks at WS 7 is savage...

- Beanz

Arisos · Post by **Arisos** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:55 am

He often hides in units

If he does that he is cheating!

Character with the alter kindred can never join a unit.
If he shoots you you can shoot back with the lifetaker.

Drakken · Post by **Drakken** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:37 am

Key Points:

1. Alter Kindred cannot join Units.
2. With the new targetting rules, all you need is LoS. Lifetaker is a good tool, or any simple magic missile. He'll only have at best, 5+ Armor Save (WE can't take Heavy Armor).

Comrade igor · Post by **Comrade igor** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 10:39 am

Positioning. An Altar HB needs LoS to you to shoot you, use that to your advantage by placing missile troops near potential targets so that if he pops up to shoot your guys, you can shoot him back. You wont necessarily kill him with xbow fire, but he will think twice about comming out in the open.

WE tend to be light on magic too, so magic missiles would be especially effective as they negate his ward, place a mage with the missile troops.

Nagathi · Post by **Nagathi** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 12:44 am

The Ward item you speak of is Amaranthine Brooch.
His initiative is raised to 9.
A more common ward for that alter is the SotCM.

They're really vulnerable, and will die if targetted. Just about anything will kill him, especially magic missiles and the Lifetaker. Charge him and he'll soon die (9 Harpies will keep him busy as he'll strike last).

~ Nag

Beriothien · Post by **Beriothien** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:30 am

Bow of Loren is not longer the strength of the shooter...it is just a multiple shot longbow S3.

And to what everyone else said - no being within 5 inches of a friendly unit protection anymore. If you can be seen, you can be hit.

"ouch"

Nightblade183 · Post by **Nightblade183** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:44 am

My friend tried an alter noble on me at 500pts I marched 6 corsairs infront of it first turn, he charged i fled leaving him exposed to 7 Cold One Knights with FC. He died... i dunno if this helps anyone else but baiting worked for me, but he probably won't fall for that again.