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shadowblade worth it in 7th edition? 
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Noble
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Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:15 am
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see the book ,and his gifts combination sads me

ya , he is cheaper for those special ability but it is badly combined IMO.
no rune of khaine means : 4 ASF poison killing blow attacks for 3 RBT prize..

with only 4 attacks , both with poison and KB isnt good option

his ability :

taking out warmachine = best (but they always cheaper than him)

taking out chariots = good (but one time boost)

taking out character in a unit = without Strength potion he can only deal with champion and sorceress but likely lose that combat. If he is using potion , enemy can choose sacrifice his champion or using the super character to beat him down


Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:03 am
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Executioner

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 7:48 am
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UndeadcatD wrote:
with only 4 attacks , both with poison and KB isnt good option


He's got Dark Venom, though, and according to the Toxin rules, having a Toxin removes the model's Poisoned Attacks. So the Poisoned Attacks in his entry seems to be an oversight (I've got a post up about this in the General forum).

Dark Venom counts wounds inflicted in a challenge twice when calculating combat results. That combined with his killing blow ability seems to suggest that he's designed to go after mid-level characters (I don't think he really has enough attacks to go after the more powerful characters; but the ability to hide in an enemy unit and pop out with 4+d3 killing blow attacks would probably be too powerful).


Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:16 am
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Dragon Lord
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Remember shadowblade never had rune of khaine, he doesn't want any artificial enhancements to his skills,
Non magic weapons and toxins, and some ToK abilities that are not items.
Rune of Khaine is a brand giving frenzy-like effects.

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8th Edition army book W/D/L:
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Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:24 am
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Malekith's Best Friend
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He was pretty broken in 6th ed. 7 kb attacks. I think he's fine now. You could field him without feeling dirty.


Mon Jul 21, 2008 7:00 am
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Black Guard

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2004 7:55 am
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I think there'll be a very strong build with him and a dragon, meaning you don't worry about opponents having teclis or other nasty casters like that. With hatred, 4 attacks and ASF, he's probably about as good as he was before.


Mon Jul 21, 2008 3:49 pm
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I like the new Shadowblade. Not only is he GT legal now, but he's a hero-choice to boot.

Of course they had to cut down his killing potential (as keeping a Lord-like killing ability as a hero, and the addition of Hatred meant that on Average he would always get at least 1 Killing Blow in a round).

Used right though he can be a thorn in so many sides.

Taking out Warmachines, breaking small units (those 5-10man archer units are prime targets) which in turn cause panic on larger units, or even the old-fashioned shanking of enemy characters.

He has to be used carefully as he's still vulnerable but when used correctly he is definately a potent force multiplier.

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Mon Jul 21, 2008 7:35 pm
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Dark Rider

Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:20 am
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For what he has, I think you're better off fielding a regular assassin that's as tooled up as possible in a unit of shades. It's still cheaper and you have a character that can actually help out in combats rather than just against characters. Give him the cloak of Peter Pan and he'll be able to kill Wizards just as well as Shadowblade can... And faster...


Mon Jul 21, 2008 7:54 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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@KrystalIce

Yes that's what I thought first too. But don't forget that he can hide in enemy units! A real feat for an assasin don'tcha think?

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Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:39 pm
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Assassin
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IMO Shadowblade gives you the opportunity to remove one or some crucial parts of the enemy army on T1 whch you could not access otherwise - let it be the cannons on a hill, the Lv4 mage etc. .
Apart from the option to kill this one object your enemy has to deal with the maniac behind his lines in some way...
Quote:
taking out warmachine = best (but they always cheaper than him)
If he gets one cannon he will get a second with the overrun.


Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:44 pm
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Black Guard

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War machines are probably the safest thing to take with him, since they likely won't hurt him even if they catch him.


Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:13 pm
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Dragon Lord
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I was thinking about shadowblade as warmachine take out-er... but then I thought of this:

Assassin
2nd Hand Weapon
Rune of Khaine
Cloak of Twilight

He can get to warmachines on turn 1 as well and spanks them compared to shadowblade. You can use the remaining ToK items allowance to make him a little more versatile by giving him for example Manbane for small unit of toughies.

Not so sure about shadowblade now that our assassins are so useful ;)
I guess Shadowblade is still great to jump on enemy level 4 wizard on turn 1 and take out most of opposing magic.

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7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:17 pm
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Executioner

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 7:48 am
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Dalamar wrote:
Assassin
2nd Hand Weapon
Rune of Khaine
Cloak of Twilight

He can get to warmachines on turn 1 as well


Unless your opponent is canny enough to hold onto a dispel die (or a dispel scroll) just to see if you're planning on using any bound items after he's blown his dispel dice.


Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:02 am
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Khaindar
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Wait, Shadowblade only has four attacks? (including AHW, so only 3 profile attacks)

That's pretty lame for a master assassin. Doesn't he even have the Rune of Khaine?

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Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:40 am
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nope. he has the hand of khaine for KB.


Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:06 am
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@Cenyu: It appears that it is so... :x

But honestly - the Shadowblade we have had in 6th ED was really over the top. He could kill pretty much anything without sweating.

For the rest - I think that normal assassins are a bit more worthwhile if the rest of your army can deal with things such as war machines on their own. Having Shadowblade in your army means that you can take out at least one war machine without having to sacrifice anything for it (RBT are the most notable example - it always takes two units of which at least one is most likely to die (I usually have to sacrifice a unit of DR and Harpies to get rid of one RBT...). If I had shadowblade this sacrifice would disappear. Shadowblade pretty much is the answer to über-characters like Teclis etc. but he is not really needed in an army build - and he is far from being a no-brainer but with hatred and 4 attacks with KB he can still cause some damage, but at 300 points he is pretty pricey and considering that a normal assassin can give us considerably more killiness.

HUZZAH!

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Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:07 am
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What is better though, Shadowblade, or taking 2-4 units of Harpies and having points left over.

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Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:56 pm
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Noble
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an anvil of doom counts as a warmachine, correct? I'm not certain, as I do not have my dwarf book in front of me.


Tue Jul 22, 2008 11:08 pm
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Dragon Lord
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I would say 2 units of harpies and vanilla assassin would perform better than Shadowblade in most circumstances
There's still few moments when Shadowblade shines though (taking out level 4 casters hiding in infantry units is the biggest one)

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7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Tue Jul 22, 2008 11:50 pm
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Elfik wrote:
What is better though, Shadowblade, or taking 2-4 units of Harpies and having points left over.


Both!

But then again, my new list for this GT season includes Shadowblade, 3 units of Harpies and a tooled up Assassin, so I've just taken all 3 of the units in question ;)

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Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:00 am
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Malekith's Best Friend
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Only four attacks is a serious drawback for this special character....vanilla assassins = just as effective without the appropriate cheese monkey stigma that comes with fielding special characters in a GT list.

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Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:04 am
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Executioner

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The bonus from Shadowblade is the ability to stick him in an enemy's unit. This means that even against the ultimate bunker VC player, you still have a shot at taking down his Army General...

... on Turn 1 of the game.

Admittedly, it's probably not very likely. But it could happen with a Killing Blow. And no matter how good your opponent's bunker is, there's nothing that he can do about it since you can stick Shadowblade in his unit.

You can't do that with a regular assassin.


Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:08 am
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Dragon Lord
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Shadowblade can't appear on turn 1 anymore, starting from turn 2
so regular assassin with cloak beats him to that as well ;)

As for charging the bunker, it all depends on the deployment

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7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:33 am
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Executioner

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Dalamar wrote:
Shadowblade can't appear on turn 1 anymore, starting from turn 2
so regular assassin with cloak beats him to that as well ;)

As for charging the bunker, it all depends on the deployment


You're almost certainly not going to be able to Steed of Shadows into your opponent's bunkered General on the first or second turn of the game.

Unless, of course, he does something overly reckless and leaves the General's unit up on top of a hill.

So no line of sight for the charge even if you do get to fly 20".


Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:04 am
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Dragon Lord
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Not all bukers I've seen are screened from the front, they are just huge tarpits with flanks covered so they don't crumble too fast.
As said, it depends on deployment.

_________________
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:10 am
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Executioner

Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:52 pm
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What ToK upgrades does he get besides the shurikens, KB and the dark venom, if any?


Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:43 am
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