Can you buff dark shards to give better BS

[Fleebo]

Hi there iv been looking and wondering are there any buff that you can put on a unit of dark shards to give them a better chance to hit in those early rounds where the -1 one penaltys come in for things such as , over half way , fire a repeter bolt insted of the one and moved that turn

Thank you for any advice

[Sangfroid]

Enchanted blades of abian spell (metal magic) gives plus 1 to hit (as well as magical attacks but not ap for darkshards as they already have armour piercing

Or flaming sword of ruin from fire magic plus 1 to wound doesnt help the hits of course but makes it easier to wound , similarly soulblight (death magic) & withering (shadow) both reduce toughness so easier to wound with the hits you get.

[Thraundil]

Sadly, no way to make darkshards in a dark elf army hit "super great". But... What is this you say. Host of the Eternity King? High magic + darkshards? Hand of Glory? Yeah.

[Demetrius]

Enchanted Blades or Harmonic Convergeance can help hit more, Withering, Flaming Sword or Soulblight can help wound more.

My suggestion is not to take Dark Shards. They get hit by most comp systems, are overcosted, and Dark Riders/ Shades/ Bolt Throwers all shoot much better.

[Dark reaper]

Darkshards are core, which is easily their greatest asset. Dark Riders are better, but the comparison to Shades and RBTs is not a good one. You are undoubtedly going to be picking them over Darkshards, but they won't fill your core.

[Lord Drakon]

I think it is the same as with reapers, you have to invest in numbers to make them effective. Same as that 4 RBT are most of the times much more effective than taking 2. Same with darkshards, if you take 10 or two of 10 on different flanks, they won't hit that much. When you take one unit of 25 - 30 or 3 of 10 (where the latter can concentrate shooting) you will see that 60 shots generate enough hits. Rolling dice is about luck, but the more dice you roll, the less luck but average possibilities becomes important.

Shadow and Heavens are both great to make them much more effective. Soulblight is one of the autospells most DE armies have with their warlocks, and - 1 T is devastating for any unit when pampered with shots. A second unit of warlocks or withering of shadow makes you wound on 2 or 3's. Harmonic Convergence, canceling all those 1 out, especially for reapers, is simply amazing.

I would not take Fire magic or Metal if you are just concerned with making the Darkshards more effective, lowering tougness is much more effective than + 1 to wound. Same for + 1 to hit when with Heavens you get to re-roll all (so also wound) 1's.

Besides that as Dark Reaper stated, they are core and we have so much amazing units and character builds, that I would rather use my core tax for another 10 or 20 darkshards, than a wizard caster to make them more effective.

[Phierlihy]

If using the Khaine rules, Hand of Glory can boost their ballistic skill. I've seen what it does to a pack of Razordons...it isn't pretty.

[Fleebo]

Thank you for you input and I can see your point , it is much better to take more dark shards than taking a extra wizard
I do play with doomfire warlocks so I have the death spell at my finger tips .

Iv be wighing up weather sisters of slaughter are a good choice ,
Iv not seen any positive responses on the net until I joined here ,
Could any body shead any light on them for me please

[Lord Drakon]

Simply the best infantry in the game
But that's me, I hope after tonight I can give some battle results with them.

[Fleebo]

Brill I'd love to here how they perform please keep me informed , why do you rate them so much if you don't mind me asking

[Red...]

Darkshards are not as optimum a choice as they used to be. They can be good against some foes, but against others (such as high elves) they really tank. The disadvantages stack up: limited range (24" versus 30" of bows), high inaccuracy (5+s for multishotting at long range, 6+ if you move first or face cover, and 7+ if you do both), and mediocre strength (just S3). Their strengths - including high volume of shots and armor piercing - help some, but not enough to make them worth fielding in large numbers. I typically take 1 unit of between 10 and 14 to deal with enemy fast troops.

The ways to improve them have already been covered. The Withering from the lore of shadow is probably the best of the options: by reducing an enemy's toughness, you can dramatically increase your kill ratio. If, for example, you reduce the toughness of a unit of high elf spears from 3 to 1 (the average reduction for the withering), you go from wounding on 4s to wounding on 2s, which is a huge difference.

The question is - do you already have a large number of darkshards and need to work out to use them effectively, or are you looking to purchase minis and don't know which to buy?

The shorter answer is - the best way to make darkshards good is to reduce them in height by about 3 feet, increase their weight by about 200 lbs, and replace their flimsy repeater crossbows with hardier constructions. Yes, in other words, turn them into dwarves.

[Fleebo]

So there really not worth taking them my main opponent is my dad who plays a hight elves army and beast men ,
As was said befor I am better off taken dark riders shades and RBT s
I also like the excutioners along with black guard infantry option along with witch elves with the COB just need to finger how to put all this in to a 3500 point army list now , I like the look of Hebron too I'll be taken her as a general
But not too shur where to put her , I am open to suggestion

[Sangfroid]

Multi shot hitting on 5s is still better than not multi shot hitting on 4s math wise at least, in any case only ever taken shards twice into battle and was not impressed by them at all, but I will say my lists are never sit back and let the enemy come to me, I. Always looking to pour forward and get stuck in, maybe with a cauldron rerolling all to wounds, a good amount of shards backed up by RBT, shadow or metal magic might be a different story :-)

[T.D.]

Iv be wighing up weather sisters of slaughter are a good choice ,
Iv not seen any positive responses on the net until I joined here ,
Could any body shead any light on them for me please

...

Brill I'd love to here how they perform please keep me informed , why do you rate them so much if you don't mind me asking

The Shrine of Slaughter has seen combat.. and how !!
It killed his whole army all by itself, damn that unit is amazing :

- 22 warriors of chaos
- 1 BSB hero
- 1 LVL 2 hero
- 1 chariot
- 5 chaos knights

All with the - 1 CC mark of Nurgle.

With only 1 !!! casualty in return. The handmaiden of shards got killed by his much stronger BSB (7 got killed by enemy Hellcannon, 2 + Shrine by his demon prince magic in turn 5).

[marcopollo]

Harmonic convergence can bubble its effect to 12" radius. Set up a decent gunline with DS and RBT's and you've got a nasty shooting phase.

[Saintofm]

I have had some fun with them recently against a warriors of chaos player (they didn't do much against his armor, but they were fun). They are basically made for moderately armored and moderately tough foes. And while an average range does seem to hamper them when compared to the arrow spamming high elves, these guys do have a few noticeable advantages.

They have light armor standard and can take shields. They can have magic banners, which while admittingly very limited in this edition (what do you mean we only get the hyper expensive magic banner RARRRRRGH? Where is my hydra banner?) its still an advantage.

Out of Curiosity what units have they been shooting at and what armies do you tend to fight?

[Red...]

what armies do you tend to fight

my main opponent is my dad who plays a hight elves army and beast men

@Fleebo: I have quite a bit of experience fighting high elves (hence my over zealous responses to your posts) and I've learned a lot of what I can share the hard way:
- 1) You will lose a missile fight with a high elf player who chooses to go that route. His archers have longer range and can volley fire. He can also use Handmaidens of something, who are insanely brokenly good (BS5, WS5, S4 bows with additional AP against evil units). He can shoot at you from turn one, while you are guaranteed to have to move forward to shoot, even if you get the first turn. A ferociously savage high elf player will place his archers exactly 29.1" away from your RxBs, thus ensuring that you cannot shoot at him on your first turn, while he can get a full salvo off against you.
- 2) Magic defense is essential. High elves have access to a lot of nasty lores and spells. You need to bring at least a level 4 (for that +4 to dispel) and a level 1 (to carry a dispel scroll) and ensure to dispel the right spells at the right time (e.g. do not let him cast flesh to stone on his unit of phoenix guard who just engaged your unit of blackguard). Any offensive benefits from your magic casters is helpful, but their essential inclusion is because of magic defense here.
- 3) Our infantry can and will outshine his. So take it, and use it aggressively. Before the most recent army book, ASF really hurt us, but now that we have it as well, our infantry is simply better. Take horde units of blackguard and witches with a cauldron of blood and push them forward aggressively. Do not let his missile fire deter you: you need to get into combat with him quickly and decisively.
- 4) Screeners are very useful for marginalizing the impact of his shooting. Place some harpies or shades in front of your big units - that way he either has to target them (protecting your big units) or take a crippling -2 penalty if he wants to shoot through them.
- 5) On that note, a neat trick you can use is to place units of shades about 12.1" in front of his missile troops - he then has to focus on them, while you move your own forces forward. Be careful, though, because if your shades run away, they may get in the way of your advancing troops.

[Fleebo]

Thanks for that it's much appreciated

[Ajattaro]

Harmonic convergence can bubble its effect to 12" radius. Set up a decent gunline with DS and RBT's and you've got a nasty shooting phase.

Harmonic converge all the way. It helps both with hitting and wounding. Bubble effect with RBT is really nasty with either type of shots. With current book I pretty much always use this combo to make them worthwhile.

Flaming banner is another thing to take with this combo. Augmented flaming shooting is deadly for regenerators.

I also like to use small unit of DS with full command + flame banner as pseudo anvil. Tank up two pegasus characters into a unit of 13DS and you get a block equivalent of 21 models and front rank full of characters/champion. Peg chars can fight too.

Against shooting armies i advance with the DS unit and tank up characters there again. BS shooting hurt only troops and template weapons wont do lot of hits... And if DS suffer its only wounds away from somewhere else. When you get close to enemy characters can be delivered where they are needed