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Ras' haven't played in 6 months list [Games 1 and 2] 
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M-A-D
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Hi,

Some of you may have spotted me lurking for a couple of days. Some of you will undoubtedly know me, some of you (those with a 07 joined date) don't. In any case I haven't played a game in 6 months and having spent nearly three weeks in bed with the flu I have decided I should like to play a game again. That said unless some one makes a pillgramige to London I shan't be having a game untill mid May. Which will probably be the earliest I can play anyway. I'll have made my final film and be looking for a job or what have you, so will have some free time.

Any way. Having not played for 6 months I doubt I am ready to go back to the list I was trailing previously. Its a little too experimental and difficult to use to just pick up and play with. So having enjoyed KidA's thread and Joey's idea about Chains and boobs and having nearly finished my own convo I came up with this ickle list based on something I played with a while ago and enjoyed. Its not an amazing list, but should be fun...

Culty Carn V1.0

Kipper
Sorceress (MOS, lvl 2, 2 Scrolls)
Noble (MOS, Titty Snake, Chaos Armour, Sh, Lance, Bindings of Slaanesh)

12 Devoted, FC - Speed of Slaanesh
5 Shades
10 Warriors (RXB and Shields)

6 Mounted Daemonettes
5 Riders (RXBs, MOS)
5 Knights, S
5 Knights, S (Warbanner)

Reaper
Reaper

2246pts in total
8 PD
5 DD + 2 Scrolls


So the first problem is that I don't own any MDs or a Kipper. But, I guess I might buy them. My regular opp is rather used to me subbign things, so I guess it'll pass as normal. Would be nice to play with a full painted list. Still got a month or so.

Its a shame I didn't have the points to mark the Bolters and the Warriors, but I think the other things are more important in the list. I should have liked to mark the RXBs to give my General two places to go, same goes for the RXBs, but 20 pts is a lot to pay for those RXBs. The Riders are marked for several reasons. Firstly to allow the noble to go there as and when, taking up a non-stupid safet house. Secondly it provides new options, takes the opp off guard and general allows for tricks.

The pair of kight unit are fairly standard me. The second banner is because its really about time I did it. Although WYIYG I don't have one, so I may swap it for the mark on the RXBs as and when. Its about as high punch as you can get in the cult, and as those who know me know, I need alot of S5+ in my army lists.

Right, enough from me. Thoughts, opinions and observations, not to mention comments and suggestions are most welcome.

Ras

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Last edited by Rasputinii on Tue Apr 10, 2007 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:32 pm
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Ras!

I've been interested in that list of yours for a long time, and actually just came back here after a long hiatus (though I'm ever mostly a lurker) curious if anyone had revived a Keeper CoS list. Other than the Brettonian mini-batrep you posted way back when, what were your experiences with it? What do you think 7th edition changes about it?

Keenly interested!

Jason


Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:37 am
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Undercover Asrai
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Oh man, I've been thinking about Keeper CoS list the other day (for non-tournament purposes)...and I've just started making all the needed alterations when I've (again) realized that Keeper eats a Rare slot. So I see you've made a difficult choice - I couldn't have.

As for the list itself - I like it. Personally, I don't like double Knights, but anything that makes a Greater Daemon army look more elfish is a good thing. Also, why 2 Scrolls. I'd prefer scroll+seal as I find 6+1 setup a bit better than 5+2. But those are just minor details...

EDIT: I see you've made several remarks regarding marked characters not being to able non-marked units - well, they can. So, I'd drop MoS from any unit it wouldn't normally have (like Raiders) and put it on RBTs. Placing a Boobnoble in a non-marked unit should be protection enough for Fear tests...

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Last edited by Kida on Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Apr 02, 2007 7:18 am
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M-A-D
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KidA: Oh they can. Thats handy. Yes. I think swap the mark to the Reapers from the Riders. Cunning plan. As for 5+2 6+1. I can never be sure. I know 5 dice is far better then four. But I can't be sure over that 6th dice. The way I see it is that I need the uptight defense early, before the Boob Noble helps eleviate pressure on my Dice. So the two scrolls help fit in better, I think. It can always be changed after playtesting. I would like to get the cloak in there. But allas I think its at the expense of too much.

As for the dilema I believe you are refering to spawn over RBTs. For me it wasn't even a choice. The RBTs are 100% necessary in such a list, spawn aren't even close. I suppose that partly comes from the fact I am not used to Spawn, and as such don't miss them. They aren't really my play style in the end. And reapers are just so useful in a small model count slightly fragile army. But hen I guess so are spawn. And they are cheaper. But I only have one spawn model, and I have two reapers.

Xeperi: Not only are you a very long lurking lurker but you are one with a fantastic memory. I salute you. I'm not massively sure how 7th changes it, but then I haven't played a game in 6 months and that was at th time when 7th had just been released. So my experience of the new edition is rather limited. My main problems with 7th with respect to building a druchii list is putting casters in units and 5 wide infantry units. Neither of these really impact on this army. It means the Devoted have to go 5-5-2 and the General is better off in a unit then not, but it also brings the positive that I can hide the boob noble, where as before he was a ickle vulnerable to being skewerd every which way by arrows, crossbows, blowpipes etc etc. The magic changes mean I have to think a bit more and the new charging and fleeing rules mean pulling off different manuver, but overall I feel the list retains its vallidity and can work much in the way it could in 6th.

The really great thing abotu the Kipper is he is fast and breaks ranks. So unlike my mounted Annointed version which has the same units in it The keeper is like another unit. Hes not quite as deadly as 5 S8 attack that always go first (WHY DOESN'T THE KEEPER HAVE THE MOS SO HE CAN GO FIRST?), but he can single handedly flatten a unit with a flank charge. Thanks to his gifts if he wins combat he basically sounts as winning by one more then he does. So he can have the enemy testing on -3 from a solo chrarge, and if he gets a single rank svav unit in the flank, then its good night mr tom. He is a little vulnerable to magic and shooting, but he does get a 5+ ward against artillery, which helps. But in combat he almost always gets to fight first and the enemy are hitting on 5s and often wounding on 6s, so he is fairly safe against units and the like. So he is effectively my fourth hardcore combat unit, after the knights and Mounted Daemonettes. He is also of the cost that means you gotta kill him to win realistically. And alot of armies just can't do it. Brets will always struggle. Skaven will find it hard as will elven armies and Vampires, unless they can get a Vamp into B2B with him, and even then its not a one sided fight.

Ras

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:28 am
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ras, firstly good to see you back. now on the list, i love it, only a few suggestions i would make. i would lose a knight unit for another unit of dark riders. purely because its less risky, faster and gives more shooting. other than that i wouldnt change anything else. oh and are you planning on entering any tournaments(like pompey pillage?)

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:03 am
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I've been dreaming of the Cult lately myself for non-GT tournaments, simply because its similar in style to regular Dark Elves, but somehow also completely different, if you know what I mean. :P The one thing thats stopped me so far is the fact I know nothing about making such a list... I do like the idea of the Keeper though. The double Knight unit seems strange, but cool and overall you've got yourself a small but deadly list, which I like a lot. I can't really suggest much because I'm so inexperienced with the list.

Welcome back, I was wondering where you went.

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:22 am
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Kurlan, good to "see" you again.
Firstly on the subject of tournies. To be honest I only have one planned, that being Tanelorn, 'cos I can go from my own little house and its a fairly small investment, and I am sure people I know will be in attendance. Pompey and that would be nice. But I haven't the funds to invest in Hotels and what have you, so it would be an unrealistic goal to aim to go, though it might be nice. In any case I plan t play as an indep from D.net rather then a Shenagin this year, primarily because my Team S shirt is way to big for me, and I'm not into that gangsta, wear your clothes three sizes too big for you malarky. Just got to get some white Electrical tape to write "RAS" on the back of my D.net shirt.

As for a second unit of riders. I don't really see what they would accomplish in the list. Fine they are fast and shoot, but they are not about too kill anything, and the knights are. And in any case I m of the school of thought that insist you should have either no stupidity or lots. The original incarnation of the list had two units of MDs and two units of Dark Riders, and it worked, but the simple fact is that MDs are damned fragile, damned expensive in £££ and lack the magic S5 that I have come to adore.

Edit:

Dancing Pigeon: Thanks for the comment. I know exactly what you mean, I think its what draws most of us to the Cult from the regular Nilla list. A chance to have something a bit spicy with our elves. The general negativity towards the two knight units intrigues me. I haven't encountered such a view before, or at least can't remember doing so. I am keen to know why people think its a bad idea.

Ras

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:24 am
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scrolls > dice IMO. There have ben alot more times I´ve felt I missed a scroll rather than a single DD.

As for the knights, I´d keep em. You dont really need more shooting IMO.

Not to sure about the Devoted´s Standard though, might just end up giving your opponent extra VPs. For those points you could give the sorcress a steed to be able to have her where you want to.

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The one thing thats stopped me so far is the fact I know nothing about making such a list...


Do it! It´s a fun list, my regret is selling my druchii :(

Weclome back ras

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:41 pm
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Well, it looks good to me, but I have only one thing I would change. Now, I'm sure you have reasons, but why give a Mark to the DR unit? Personally, I think that you are losing one of the key advantages of being Fast Cavalry, fleeing from charges. Why not swap the mark from the DR to the rxbs?

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 2:11 pm
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Oh I definitely intend to, danceman- I've always wanted an excuse to buy a Keeper of Secrets. :)

Ras, it wasn't so much that I was looking negatively on the 2 Knight units, I think its more that I think it strange as it seems to be a rare occurrence that people take 2 units of Heavy Cav. Right now I'm far too tired to organise my thoughts on it coherently, give me a nights sleep and a day of contemplation while at uni~ and I'm sure I'll be able to explain myself a little better.

I do agree with danceman on the subject of the Standard, though.

EDIT: Nevermind, found it :)

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Mon Apr 02, 2007 2:13 pm
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I think I'd have to see this army in action before I decide if I like it or not. I can see how I would use it myself and can see it working. However at the same time it is really tiny! You have few units and these are only just above mnimum size.

But I can't really see what I'd change either. I don't like the bindingsof slaanesh on the noble. I'm sure it will work but it makes him so expensive for little gain in many situations. I don't think you will get to use it often enough for it to be useful. I prefer going for the seal and an extra COK in one of the units. Puts some rdundancy in your magic defense.

I don't want to offer too much other advise because everything I think of turns it more into my own Kipper list and I'm sure you don't want that. My major worry thogh is exactly the problem I had with my first attempts at a kipper list: it is too small and could get shot to pieces.

p.s. I'll reply to your pm asap mate.

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Tue Apr 03, 2007 4:23 pm
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Ant: Good to see you buddy. I know what you are saying. It was a problem you had, and one I am quite aware of. It is small, and if the enemy has enough magic or shooting they can really whittle it down till it doesn't show up on the table. But when you have a 1000pts in characters and are playing with elves its a hard situation to avoid.

I'm mainly looking for this list to be good fun. Its not hard enough to be anything else. Should ease me back into the game though. I'm looking to go back to the 'nilla list I was using back is september, but I don't want to do so just yet. It was a bit too hard to use to just jump back in to.

You may well be right on the bindins. But they are kool, my new conversion is rather nice and I feel they warrant a game or two, even if a seal and enchated shield are screaming out to be more effective. But the possibility to really hit the enemy's magic phase in t.1-2 could do a huge amount in a list like mine. Well see, and as I say the noble is fun, and thats what this list is all about.

And take your time with the PM. I know I am asking alot in it.

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Tue Apr 03, 2007 4:33 pm
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Ras i have taken another look at your list and comment and yes i see now that the knights probably are needed. Even just for the 2+ save and staying and hitting power. oh and shame if you cant make pompey but i plan to be going to tanelorn so maybe see you there. But the list certainly does look like fun and if thats your main goal good for you.

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Wed Apr 04, 2007 8:09 am
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Hey Ras!

I'm really digging the list and it's nice to see you back here! I think it can work very well, it will all come down to how you play it. Kipper lists are always cool and the bindings noble is a nice way to make sure you get early magic superiorety.

Good luck and tell us how it preforms for you!

/Johan R

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Sun Apr 08, 2007 7:24 pm
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I have at least one game tomorrow against Ant with this list, so I'll let you know how it goes. I have a slight modification I should like to try out too if we get the chance.

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Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:57 pm
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Excellent! I look forward to hearing about it in as much detail as you feel like sharing with us! Good luck to you!

X


Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:54 am
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Ras!

Good to see you, sucks to hear you were sick for that long. School was well I trust. Anywho, I've not been here for a bit either and there are lots of slaaneshi daemons beside my computer, along with a Kipper staring at me.. saying paint me.. play with me. So, CoS has been calling me lately too. Regarding your list;

Neat use of the titworm, never tried to toss a noble on it.. too much of a risk for me. I'd sooner more MD and Fiends, and less RBT and CoK. Still interested to see how this works out.
Your writeups are usually pretty interesting.

Fr0

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Mon Apr 09, 2007 8:23 am
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@Fr0: Good to see you too. Hope you ar well.

@thread: I played two games today against Ant with this list, and once with my Gurgle Army. I got a minor loss to his Nurgle Deamon Army (Not a DL) first off, and then got so spanked by his Kings. Minor win with the Gurgle against the same Kings list. That kings list is unlike any kings list in the world. It doesn't suck at all.

Details either later today or tomorrow.

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Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:07 pm
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Okay.

Game 1:
Versus Ant's Nurgle Daemons.

He had:
GUO + 16 Plague Bearers
Sorcerer (lvl 2, 2 scrolls, Horse) + 4 Trolls
Asp Champ (BSB, Warbanner, Horse) + 4 Trolls

3 Nurgling Bases
5 Furies
1 Chaos Chariot (MON)
1 Beastman Chariot
1 Giant

I don't want to write a battle report. Really. I donna have the time. But the list worked quite well. I got a minor loss because I through the kipper away unnecessarily. He charged the Warbannered Trolls and challanged the bloke. Only the rules have changed, so Ant could move him in the unit to the other side. I didn't have the ability to win the combat and was pinned untill the GUO + unit flanked, and then pop. It was silly a mistake that cost me the game really. I should have not challanged, but I also should have not challanged, and moved the kipper round the rear for a rear charge, even if it would have meant loosing a unit of knight. Oh yeah, failing three stupidity tests in the first two turn didn't help.

But I am not complaining, I made silly mistakes and lost. Learning points:
- The list is small and fragile. I can't really through units away.
- More Devoted would be nice.
- Two Units of knights are good, despite the stupidity. One needs something with an armour save.
- The MOS on the Riders is good, well worth the points. It stays.
- The Kipper is good, but not as good as I think he is. Also, he suffers from not flying. Need to be more careful with that. It is nice having another unit in the army but I can't help but feel that an Annointed with the Venom Sword would be better.
- The Bindings are fun...

Game 2
Vs Ants TKs with Khalida.
I'm not going to write a report. He got first turn and everything bar the Knights who were flighting loosing combats against Scorps and Ushabti, as well as the DRs was Dead. Oh I had one shade and one RBT. Hoever it wash his turn next. So I resigned. Ant has amazing luck. 8 Poisoned hits from 20 shots type luck. That and panicking my RXBs + Sorc of the board in his T.1. But it didn't really make a difference. His list is really good and a small fragile list like mine was never going to beat it. I just learnt that lots of poisoned shooting really hurts, as does magic when you loose your general in T.1.

Ant agreed that the list is alright. Its certainly not bad. Its vulnerable to shooting and magic, and really is very small indeed. I am severly tempted to loose the Kipper for an Annointed with the Venom sword. As even with the Kipper I don't really have a way to deal with monsters, well I do, but it takes lots of points and more time then I would like. The annointed can just go in and tank things. I mean he should kill a unit of 3 Ogres outright on the charge.... Might try a few games with the Kipper though. He does give me a big caster and effectively another unit over the annointed.... Thoughts?

Ras

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Tue Apr 10, 2007 4:50 pm
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Kipper hands down. The Anointed needs two suporting mages if your thinking about him. Also as you said, the kipper is a unit in himself. And to be honest your thred has inspired a Kipper list of my own. I'v only ever played with the Anointed+2 lvl2 games and it worked okey but I was always lacking in units since while slaanesh magic is great you really need the unit count and hige strength attacks to make the most out of it.

I'll be posting up my 2250p list I'v been thinking about, but be warned it's very similar to yours ;)

/Johan R

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Wed Apr 11, 2007 3:42 pm
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