need help in making a GOOD 2000pt army with my theme!!!

[Imdat tauble]

OK, my theme is assassination, as all of you might know, and the problem is that i just can't get a good army list together - its always falling short in such a way that its gonna get massacred! so i decided to ask u guys, and post a couple of ideas that ive had so far.

the next couple of things are stuff that will never change for my army - try and get me to put them in all you can, but I just won't due to fluff reasons

Things that are ALWAYS in my armies: 1 assassin, 2 units of at least 15 executioners

Things that are NEVER in my armies: Highborn, Noble (xcept BSB), Corsairs, CoK, Cold one Chariot, Witch elves, Black Guard, CoB, RBT (yes, its a HUGE loss, but unfortunately it has to go...)

Dogs of war are definitely viable, by the way...

Here are two armies ive made up for you guys to look at, i need revisions, advice, or completely new lists that i can use...

The first one:

1 * Beastmaster @ 124 Pts
General; 2ndWeapon
Web of Shadows [25]

1 Dark Pegasus @ [55] Pts

1 Sorceress @ 152 Pts
Magic Level 1
Dispel Scroll [25]
Dispel Scroll [25]

1 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

1 Assassin @ 154 Pts
2ndWeapon
Manbane [25]

1 Assassin @ 154 Pts
2ndWeapon
Manbane [25]

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

19 Executioners @ 250 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

19 Executioners @ 250 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

5 Shades @ 75 Pts
Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour

5 Harpies @ 65 Pts
2ndWeapon

25 Halflings @ 170 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician

Casting Pool: 3

Dispel Pool: 3

Models in Army: 104


Total Army Cost: 1998



The Second list:

1 High Sorceress @ 410 Pts
General; Magic Level 4; Lore of Dark Arts
Lifetaker [30]
Black Amulet [50]
Darkstar Cloak [20]

1 Dark Pegasus @ [55] Pts

1 Sorceress @ 192 Pts
Magic Level 2
Dispel Scroll [25]
Dispel Scroll [25]

1 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

1 Assassin @ 154 Pts
2ndWeapon
Manbane [25]

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

6 Dark Riders @ 151 Pts
Spear; Repeating Crossbow; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

6 Dark Riders @ 115 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Musician

6 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

16 Executioners @ 217 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

17 Executioners @ 228 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

5 Shades @ 70 Pts
Repeating Crossbow

8 Harpies @ 104 Pts
2ndWeapon

15 Pikemen @ 206 Pts
Pike; Heavy Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Champion @ [10] Pts

Casting Pool: 9

Dispel Pool: 5

Models in Army: 86


Total Army Cost: 1998

so, any ideas at all???[/b]

[Imdat tauble]

hello??? need a little help here...

[Lord Thalack]

Well I really want to help but its really difficult, because there are a lot of good troops you don't want to use. You could take some big monsters like beastmaster on manticore and a war hydra, but that wouldn't really fit into your theme. Maybe you should allow yourself to use some more troops.

Bye
Lord Thalack

[Lord Eldur]

Halflings?? In an Assasination themed army?? It sounds at least weird, don´t you think? With the exclusions list you have i think it´s about the best you can get, but try to use another mercenary help, please!

[Sneaky]

I agree. Halflings in an assassination army is a "definitely not". An assassination army feels like a mercenary army, so you could put in a bunch of Dogs of War units.

I'm thinking something along the lines of one or two sorceresses MAX, NO lords (maybe it sucks, but I don't think an assassin army is that honourable even for druchii) and many assassins. For DoW units, take a couple units of Pikemen. Take DR for your core choices, and Execs as your special.

A few units of Spears could be good as well. Corsairs fit the bill - they're pirates, so to speak. I can only think of a few things that you can't take. WEs are NOT assassins, Hydras and other big monsters are no-nos (Dark Pegasi are fine, though).

Honestly? I'm not sure.

[Imdat tauble]

corsairs!!! of course, nearly forgot about those!!!

and now that i think about it, halflings aren't that great a move, pikemen are a lot better...

warriors aren't worth it - i think im going to go for like no shooting, but lots of flanking etc. Shooting gets screwed up a bit... and using pikemen etc. means i can sorta do without... plus i need the extra points (of course shades etc. will be used... i need to take out those pesky war machines)

monsters are a possible maybe... theres a small chance he coulda bought some, but not much, so i might use them rarely, but not much.

wot i need is something to distract the attention from my exes, and right now all i can think of is a hydra - which is sorta screwed. ne1 have any ideas for this?

[Imdat tauble]

wot about this...

1 Sorceress @ 152 Pts
General; Magic Level 1
Dispel Scroll [25]
Dispel Scroll [25]

1 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

1 Assassin @ 154 Pts
2ndWeapon
Manbane [25]

1 Assassin @ 154 Pts
2ndWeapon
Manbane [25]

15 Corsairs @ 185 Pts
2ndWeapon; Light Armour; Sea Dragon Cloak; Standard; Musician

1 Reaver @ [10] Pts

15 Corsairs @ 185 Pts
2ndWeapon; Light Armour; Sea Dragon Cloak; Standard; Musician

1 Reaver @ [10] Pts

5 Dark Riders @ 97 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Musician

5 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

5 Dark Riders @ 97 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Musician

5 Dark Steed @ [0] Pts

16 Executioners @ 217 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

15 Executioners @ 206 Pts
Great Weapon; Light Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Draich-master @ [12] Pts

5 Shades @ 70 Pts
Repeating Crossbow

5 Shades @ 70 Pts
Repeating Crossbow

15 Pikemen @ 206 Pts
Pike; Heavy Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Champion @ [10] Pts

15 Pikemen @ 206 Pts
Pike; Heavy Armour; Standard; Musician

1 Champion @ [10] Pts

Casting Pool: 3

Dispel Pool: 3

Models in Army: 120


Total Army Cost: 1999

that way i get quite a lot of troops... and it means that i'll also have a few targets instead of just exes.

[Lord Thalack]

Looks good. Just tell us if it worked when you've played with it.

Bye
Lord Thalack

[Imdat tauble]

thanx - will do!

[Sneaky]

It looks like you have a system where, going from the middle out, you have Pikes, Corsairs, Executioners, Dark Riders. You have a couple of Assassins mucking about, and a Sorceress being a pain in the bottom to the opposition. You also have a couple of units of Shades up the front.

Very symmetrical. It should work, and it feels like an assassin-for-hire army. I can see this army going about killing off dissenting Druchii Nobles, taking out High Elf leaders, and being a general nuisance. I look forward to fighting it in the civil war.

[Imdat tauble]

thanx for the advice. I'll probably be making a few changes, like maybe a few magic banners here and there for support... i think i'll need it.

actually wot i was thinking of doing was having the similar units working together in flanking pairs - the pikemen togethere in the centre as a defense more than anything, the exes on one flank and the corsairs on the other. DR'sthere to help along with andything that might go screwy and to help with those pesky mages and war machines...

[Redemptionist]

pretty good army but try and find the points to give your assassins ruin/hand of khaine(whichever one gives +1attack) this will increase the goodness of manbane considerably

[Imdat tauble]

unfortunately I've decided to go fluffy here, and that unfortunately means that no skills with Khaine are really allowed...

[Leithel and odd]

Well, the list is really cool and probably hard to beat but I would hav ethought that Pikemen go against the Assassination theme as well as they are a basic defensive unit. They are however VERY good for the type of army you've created as it's mostly on the offensive and doesn't have a huge amount of defence, especially for your shooters.

Cool list, I like the theme.

[Imdat tauble]

I just had a thought: against shootier armies, wot if i went magic heavy and just chillwinded until nothing could shoot my exes??? would that work well???

[Hellebron]

Okay, there are two things with your list and your intention which I just don't understand:

1: Why do you include Sorceresses in a list that is based on an assassination theme? Assassins are raised in the Temples of Khaine, and they don't like Sorceresses!

2: Why do you exclude Witch Elves? They, too, are raised in the Temples of Khaine...

[Imdat tauble]

um, if you read the chronicles of delthazor in the history of the druchii forum, it might explain a few things... the fact that i have more than 1 assassin might be a bit unfluffy (unfortunate but true)

[Lord katan]

Steja, Steja, Steja, what are ya thinking my man??? You don't have Vesperos's Vendetta on your army list??? You know that dogs of war duelists regiment....they are absolutely a must for your army. I have some other suggestions too. Now since it is an assassination army, I kinda picture a dark elf host with the soul purpose of setting off to destroy a particular character or specific unit, kinda like in Gladiator. Anyways, Corsairs do fit the bill, dark riders, and even scouts. I would paint them in a nice black scheme, with facepaint, make them look like shadowy figures. I wouldn't take too many executioners if your worried about winning, too many can be trouble. But it sounds like you are worried more about theme, so so be it, sounds cool to me. I would even use spearmen in this army, so it is kinda like a city armythat has been dispatched to eliminate someone...loaded onto an ark in har garneth and sent asail to ulthulan. pretty cool idea.

[Sneaky]

Now praise me. I gave him the idea; as well as introduced him to Warhammer.

I like getting praise, what can I say...

Anyway, the point was (jeez, I had a point?) that YES!!! You need the duellists! How could I have been so stupid to leave them out?

I figure that any DoW fits the bill, but those are especially good. That's part of the reason I suggested the pikemen. Plus, well, you needed something that could sit in the middle. But Corsairs do just that, so you don't need to bother with the pikeheads.

I'm thinking that you drop the pikemen, take a couple of units of 20 Corsairs with some Executioners on the flank, a unit of Duellists, Dark Riders, and shades. I also think that you need two Assassins, a Sorceress, and something else that's cool... I dunno, look at the DoW lists.

[Imdat tauble]

ok, then im thinking to take a unit of pikemen, a unit of duellists, 2 units of exes (maybe only 12 a unit - as they're gonna be flanking etc. i dun really need more) a couple a units of shades, a couple a units of corsairs, and a couple a units of dr's (sorry, but i dun really like spearlen, so they're out.)

also, i'm gonna cut down to 1 assassin, coz of the fact that no assassin in his right mind really will want to go with delthazor (i mean he defied khaine for khaines sake! that didnt come out right did it, anyway) and so the 1 assassin will be delthazor himself. Then im thinking of going a little heavier on magic - the idea is to chillwind the other guy until he cant shoot no more, thus saving my guys from lots of nasty stuff coming they're way.

that sound good, or is this just screwed?