2000 pts against High Elves... Help me to not die horribly

[Tal_1173]

I do not know what he is bringing. He said he has no problem with any items or combination of items. So, I am bringing some cheese... Just not the entire cheese tray. I am particularly worried about the magic phase. When I bring a lvl 4/lvl 2 combination against the high elves, it is still not enough to get past all of his magic tricks. I am trying a lower magic army this time hoping I can pick off his wizards before he can destroy me. I am also trying to see just how much damage I can do with shooting... Am I over doing it?

Dreadlord, Darksteed, HA/S/SDC, Dragonhelm, Pendant, Crown Command, Sword might, Repeater crossbow

Sorceress Lvl 2, Scroll, Guiding eye
Death Hag, Cauldron, Battle standard

29x Crossbows (insert sorc here)
30x Crossbows
5x Harpies

Cold One Chariot
Cold One Chariot
5x Shades

Reaper Bolt Thrower
Reaper Bolt Thrower
War Hydra

The dreadlord will aim for a group of scary dudes that move fast.
The bolt throwers will shoot heavily armoured things
The hydra will probably go for a horde or the phoenix guard if there?
The crossbows will concentrate fire (if necessary) on elite infantry
The harpies and the shades will attempt to hunt wizards (I never have any luck with this though...) The chariots will respond to threats and be placed in response to his placements.

Any suggestions on the list and especially the tactical plans would be greatly appreciated.

[Ace073]

I love playing against high elves. Okay, so he says youre fine to bring cheese. Being a high elf, he's only going to say that to a DE if he is bringing Teclis or Book of Hoeth.

Many people, faced with teclis, rage quit. I say, hooray! You know what both of those high elf 'cheeses' die to? Anything.

Hydra directly in the face will kill either, neither of them has any save whatsoever. Apart from that, another favourite of mine is two pegmasters with defensive gear and scourges. 4 s4 attacks each will put a naked elf in the ground. Since there are two, he cant challenge and be safe from the other with the mage. Since they are so fast, they can be charging turn 2.

He usually wont want to commit a mage to a real combat unit like swordmasters because he needs them to fight, but cant risk losing 400-500 points of mage. This means your pegmasters arent usually even worried about dying to retaliation and can grind the unit down and conserve their points. If he DID put Mr Mage in a scary unit, its a bit of a sacrificial move, but they rely on magic a LOT, and your remaining shooting should be able to do fine killing the rest of his elites. Your hydra definitely can.

I would bring a Lv4 instead of the dreadlord, high elves dont deathstar well, and that is what the dreadlord really counters. Replace him with 2 pegmasters, replace the lv2 with a lv4, (lore is up to you, but Dark is particularly good against elves, and shadow is always nice.) With sac dagger, he cant stop your phase without blatantly cheating. Or you roll 1,1 for winds of magic...

With so many crossbowmen, I would drop the bolt throwers. They are expensive and eagle food. Another hydra will help mop up the few stragglers left after your crossbows are done. If youd prefer not to double hydra, black guard are great instead, or even more shades. Shades will definitely outshoot BT's. His bolt throwers shouldnt scare you, really. Send harpies at one anyway. Just make sure pegmasters get in combat quickly so he doesnt luckshot a single bolt and kill one.

[Red...]

IMO High Elves deathstar incredibly well. A unit of 30 Phoenix Guard with Standard of +D3 Power Dice, supported by a lore of life mage is nigh unkillable. But that's a side point. Onto the OP:

Don't bring hydras. Any high elf player worth his salt will have at least one or more of the following against Dark Elves:

- Dragon Mage (fire magic, with +1 casting dice for EVERY spell cast, and a guaranteed flaming sword of rhuin spell)
- Massed archers with flaming banner

Against High Elves you want: Chariots, RxBs, Chariots and more RxBs. A level 4 mage with a sacrificial dagger and warrior fodder block is probably a good idea too.

I would advise against the two Reapers. With just two wounds each, no armour saves and sixes now always wounding, they are way too easy to kill, especially for high elf archers who have a 30" range and so can despatch them more easily than you can take out his Repeaters in return.

Your current list is near to being good, but I would recommend you make the following changes:

Change the level 2 to a level 4 with sacrificial dagger.
See if you can squeeze a level 1 with a dispel scroll in. It is really handy against High Elves.
Drop the hydra.
Drop the Reapers.
Add a block of warriors.
Consider adding some Cold One Knights (extra punch and/or a distraction for his archers).
Consider adding some harpies (good screening troops against any archers he brings).
Consider adding a third chariot.

[Prince fabulas]

I think a good way to deal with HE magical cheese is Ring of Hotek on peglord/hero.

You place him in a unit of spears (or whatever) so he can't be directly targeted by shooting and most spells as you move up.

Then you fly out near to his main wizard (where you can't be charged).

Be careful during the game (especially the start) you don't hotek yourself.

I find it's a good idea to measure the proximity of the Ring to all your own wizards at the start of your own magic phase (so you don't forget about it).

[Ace073]

Ring of hotek is better in theory than in practice I think. If you fly just behind his unit, he moves it out of range and is fine. If you are in front, he charges and probably kills you, or charges with a non mage unit and moves away. The ring is now stuck there all game, short of fleeing. The best I managed, (which was actually pretty good, was to get behind the mage bunker of PG and charge the rear of it. He couldnt leave, the poor PG couldnt hope to kill the ridiculous armour save +3wound hero. He then charged his Lv2's unit to try kill me off...

Suffice it to say it didnt do so well.

[Cold73]

Although most people seem of think of Repeater Bolt Throwers as weak.
And if I look at the math behind it, i totally agree.
15 RXB can get about the same number of wounds as two Bolt Throwers at 24", but are actually cheaper.

Personally I do use Repeater Bolt Throwers, for the simple fact that an opponent will often not waste shots at them.
I do agree that they are food for eagles...but I will happily use 10 RXB to shoot at an eagle...one less redirecter to worry about if i kill him.
Then again this only works if you have plenty of shooting. Don't forget by the time the High Elves have moved all the way over to your line, and they are all engaged in melee you can still use the Bolt Throwers to shoot at his archers who are always just out of range of you RXB.


As for the Ring of Hothek.
It's uses are mostly situational. Against High Elves I don't think it is very usefull, most HE will use Lore of Life to protect their troops and once he has gotte Throne of Vines off, he will usually not be to bothered by the occasional miscast.

@Ace073... I know the frustration it gives if a casters moves out of range of your Ring Bearer :-) but that can actually be used to your advantage. Don;t forget most caster would prefer not to come into melee at all. And here you can either force him to except miscasts; or to move towards melee.

[Prince fabulas]

I find it is best against life magic not to let your opponent get off throne of vines.

If you let it off you are just making his magic phase easier and more effective.

With clever placement of the peglord it is not always possible for the enemy mages to escape 12" without moving somewhere undesireable (especially if you can charge his unit without dying).

It takes some practice but I have found the ring very useful and cost effective (as the pegrider has other uses) magical defense.