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Towers of Despair - 2500pt 
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Shade
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Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:08 pm
Posts: 103
Location: Michigan
I have been working on a hybrid twin tower leadership bomb list. Taking many ques from Dalamar's builds and melding in some of the leadership bomb ideas and a bit of my own. I would love some feedback.

Lords - 570

Lvl. 4 of Death - 315
Sword of Anti Heroes
Black Amulet
Ironcurse Icon
(Inspiration from Dalamar's "tricky killer" sorceress build, she will be in the center front of the the shrine star. Doom and Darkness will be the key spell)

Lvl. 3 of Dark - 255
Tome of Furion (shroud of despair)
Talisman of Protection
(front corner of the shrine star to bubble out shroud towards the COB unit and still cover any opponent of the shrine star.)

Heroes - 487

Master BSB with 1+ kit - 157
Sword of Might
Helm of Discord
(Front and center on opposite side of the shrine as the lvl 4. in the shrine star. Combo up with (Shroud/Doom and Darkness/ Cry of War and Aura of Agony to force an additional ultra de-buffed leadership test and lock out enemy beat sticks pre-challenge)

Death Hag - 330
Cry of War
COB
Ogre Blade
(Ogre blade with Razor standard in WE horde combo ensures an answer to high Armour. Cry of War will add to the leadership madness - when possible you start with this combat forcing the fear test at -3 first, with shroud of despair bubbled up the -1 ld. will have impact on the shrine star combat I hope to have going nearby at the same time. Even if you can't pull the combo off I absolutely love cry of war when you are trying to blow through elite troops in one round.)


Core - 625

30x WE with FC and Razor Standard - 405
(The threat of WE horde with COB is well known but in this list it is not the crucial element - i think it will garner a ton of attention while the shrine star goes under the radar a bit. At any rate we know what this unit can do.)

5x DR with shields, RXB and muso - 110

5x DR with shields, RXB and muso - 110
(Re-directors of Re-directors, possible war-machine hunters)

Special -354

27 x Execs with FC - 354
(The Execs will be the rank and file of the shrine star. I am loving the idea of locking down a hero/lord with the Helm of Discord and then sending a bunch of auto-hit killing blow at him/her.)

Rare - 460

BRS - 175
(-1/+1 Leadership Aura with Terror is a big deal to this list, also when the shrine star's characters and champions are aligned correctly you can really mess with attack allocation and force your opponent to choose between T5, 1+, 4++ or wasting allocation on a champ. This is critical because if you are successful with a few Leadership De-buffs all you have to do is win by one to force a nasty break test; steadfast or stubborn won't mean a thing due to shroud's ability to destroy base leadership.)

Kharibdyss - 160
(I know the K-beast doesn't get a lot of love and this is probably the piece of the list I am not sure about but my thoughts are as such: #1 War-machine bait. The BRS must live and this guy will probably get some cannon attention. #2 Abyssal howl could be a game changer in a list like this, just have to get him into a flank. #3 High strength for those touch to reach places.)

5x Doomfire Warlocks - 125
(War-machine hunting and early round Doombolt to clear chaff or 6 Dice to knock out big threats)


Total - 2496

I think this could be a list that sneaks up on people. I am not sure I need the killy kit on the Lvl.4 considering I should be able to shut down character threats with the master and I hate going to war with a scroll so I am thinking I might switch the load out on her, any suggestions? This list leans on magic and combos which are fickle and I am not sure it could stand up to ITP armies though it still has kill power without the Leadership Bomb aspect IMO. I would love some input and thoughts.

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Cheers,
Oli


Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:01 pm
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PhD in Dark Magic
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Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:54 am
Posts: 592
Location: The depths of the Black Library
Interesting list. You're very character-heavy, but that's unavoidable with a build like this one. I'd be interested to hear how this list performs.

Remember, you can always use the Tome for Word of Pain against ITP opponents. My current hybrid Shroud list has done reasonably well against Daemons and VC thanks to timely use of Word of Pain against Plaguebearer and Grave Guard hordes - Word of Pain has no lower limit on WS reduction, and WS 0 opponents die like flies against Executioners.

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"The wrath of a good man is not to be feared. They have too many rules."

"Good men don't need rules. Today is not a good time to find out why I have so many."


Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:29 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:42 pm
Posts: 9675
Location: Designing new breeds of Dragons
Interesting. Where I see an issue though is complete lack of ranged threat (magic doesnt count in my book as its too unpredictable).

How do you plan to deal with flying threats like peg masters, demon princes etc?

_________________
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:30 pm
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Shade
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Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:08 pm
Posts: 103
Location: Michigan
Great Advice Haagrum I appreciate it. Dalamar I really don't have a good response that isn't magic based. I can Death snipe with my Lvl.4 and Doombolt with the Warlocks but as you said magic is a fickle beast. I will have all the models required for this list very shortly and I will let you know how it plays.

You ready for Buckeye Dalamar? What club do you play out of? I am hoping to start playing some tournaments this winter.

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Cheers,
Oli


Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:55 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:42 pm
Posts: 9675
Location: Designing new breeds of Dragons
The problem with magic as your only response is that a good opponent will see it coming and focus their magic defense where it's important.

I'll be at buckeye and the army is finally painted :P playing with the B.R.E.W.S.

_________________
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Tue Jul 08, 2014 4:53 pm
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Shade
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Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:08 pm
Posts: 103
Location: Michigan
I think I might alter the list a bit for my first few games and switch the the Lvl. 4's build to:
Black Amulet, DS, and OTS.

Now it comes down to trading out the K-Beast for two Bolt Throwers, do you think the bolt throwers will help against the threats you mention Dalamar?

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Cheers,
Oli


Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:43 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2002 6:42 pm
Posts: 9675
Location: Designing new breeds of Dragons
Definitely, demon princes are scared of them, peg masters other than CoT one will have to hide (and even CoT stands a 1/3 chance of failing). Dragons won't be as worried but more than if you had no support fire at all.

_________________
7th edition army book:
Games Played: 213
Games Won: 114 (54%)
Games Drawn: 33 (15%)
Games Lost: 66 (31%)

8th Edition army book W/D/L:
Druchii: 36/4/16


Tue Jul 08, 2014 5:55 pm
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Shade
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Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:08 pm
Posts: 103
Location: Michigan
I think I will play the list both ways and see how the games pan out. I have a hunch the reaper list will win out. I am also going to adjust my Lvl. 4's build back and forth as well.

When thinking about how a "perfectly played magic shooting and combat phases" would fold out I put together a step by step (probably turn 2-3). Does this look right to you? Do you see a better way to take advantage of the list?

Movement - charge COB WE horde at secondary combat block of opponent - immediate terror check, charge Shrine Star at main combat block - immediate terror check (the terror checks will be huge in subsequent rounds if the plan comes together)

Magic - Must have Shroud, Doom and Darkness on the main character opposing the shrine star would be second priority, Word of Pain against initiative or powered up on the shrine star's opponent would be icing on the cake

Shooting - priority would become any chaff or support units inside the shroud bubble - if I can force a test that is added value for the leadership bomb

Combat - start with COB horde impact hits then fear at -3 (lets assume the target hasn't suffered a leadership de-buff) I think it is safe to say that there will be a failed test in this combat either fear or actually breaking the unit. It's possible that nearby units would be testing for panic on a -1 but let's assume they all pass. Net leadership PIP -1 for all in 12" bubble of Lvl.3

Next is the Shrine Start. Impact hits followed by (and here is where I want the scrutiny) Fear check at max of -6 ld.(Doom and Darkness, Aura of Agony, Shroud knock x2 from WE victory/failed fear) min of -2 (no D&D or using non character LD., AoA, Shroud at only -1 either fear or victory from WE). Next up Helm of Discord targeting the D&D'd character or the biggest beat stick which should be one and the same. That character would be testing on a max of -7 LD. (Doom and Darkness, Aura of Agony, Shroud knock x3 from WE victory/failed fear x2) or a min of -2 if fear from shrine was passed . when all is said and done I like my chances of having an elite unit starting combat using the second or third best leadership value within the block suffering at least a -2 but possibly a -4. Let's slit the difference and say -3. That impacts all units within 12" of the Lvl.3. I think an average elite troop base leadership is 8 so all I have to do is win by one (keep in mind the impact hits, avert your gaze, and possibly a beat-stick locked down by the helm) and the unit will be testing on a 4 if it isn't stubborn or steadfast and a 5 if is (assume it's re-rollable, though the BSB would be where all the attacks go if it is unlucky enough to be against the shrine start). Not sure of the percentages but I like my chances of breaking the unit and causing a cascade of panic tests at -4 LD. that worsens as units fail and panic. The over run would also push the shroud bubble deeper into the enemy lines - meaning that after a turn of my opponent trying to rally on super horrid LD. for a majority of their units I would be able to declare charges on my next turn with two terror causing units that could potentially break any remaining opposing units or any units that rallied - keep in mind shroud would still be up from the turn before meaning all of the de buffs would still be in place.

I think the list take a lot of setup and can be disrupted in a few ways but given that it really depends on one key turn it allows you to go all in with the understanding that success within the given turn should lead to a big victory. It sounds pretty fickle and needs a lot to go right but I am wondering if it will still have impact if only a few of the mechanics work. Time to play test I guess....... now if my Execs would only paint themselves....

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Cheers,
Oli


Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:42 pm
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