Orcs and Goblins - first list now up

For discussion about all the lesser races of Warhammer. Talk about armies, tactics and lists to take on the Druchii here...

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Orcs and Goblins - first list now up

Post by Dark Alliance »

Finally taken the plunge into silliness and senility and started an O & G army. Nearly finished painting my first unit of Night Goblins.

So, what are the nasty combinations, if any, that have been discovered so far by people?? I'm looking for ideas people. ;)
Last edited by Dark Alliance on Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:50 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Post by Draknir »

Nasty combinations to you or your enemy?
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Post by Ant »

I got a couple (all untested though so far of course).

Gobbo wizards on chariots first. 2 reasons; 1) They don't take animosity on a chariot so will always be able to cast. 2) The chariots don't take up a special choice. And if they get knocked off they can just join another chariot.

Similar point for savage orcs on chariots. Frenzied T5 tuskgor chariots with a T5 character on are quite hard...

2 hand weapons are always a good idea too, especially with big uns. 2 S5 attacks (3 for savage orcs) is not to be sniffed at.

Savage orcs with Gork's warbanner. Similar to witch elves with banner of murder. Since frenzied charges are made after measuring you roll the extra distance before you choose what to charge.

If you don't like te last combo try black orcs with Gork's warbanner. They'll always get the extra d6 bonus when you call Waaagh so if you use both Waaagh and the banner in the same turn you have a charge range of 2d6+8 with an infantry unit!

If you go for a wizard lord 1) Go for an orc, and 2) Give him some sort of magic weapon. With the right kit these guys can be almost as dangerous as a fighty lord.

Oh, and there's the suicide gobbo with wollopa's one hit wunda and the thing that blows up when he's killed. Put him on a wolf and charge him at something. He'll die but he's a gobbo worth next to nothing and should take out a fair bit if you're lucky.

That's about all I can think of for now. Other than the obvious (this banner is great, fanatics do this etc) which I'm sure you don't need to hear).
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Post by Marauder mitch2 »

I've thought aqbout putting Tricksy Trinket on a wizard on a chariot. Nice trick especailly of woodies.

ALso the Horn of Urgok as it gives a Warlord lead army Ld 10 and your opponents -1 leadership.

A good idea is the TVI army idea.

cheers rob

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Post by Draknir »

Ant wrote: 2) Give him some sort of magic weapon. With the right kit these guys can be almost as dangerous as a fighty lord.


Skull Wand of Kaloth is a horrible weapon, and for shamans only.
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Post by Khel »

Pipes of Doom! will make that pesky cavlary run away, plus Skull wand of kaloth, if you feel like sucking out your opponents brains..Nibbla's 'Itty ring, is good for your fellow gobbo's, for it increases their WS, S and I...i think.
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Post by Rasputinii »

Garry. 3 Night Goblins Bosses and 1 Night Goblin War Boss all on Giant Squigs and four units of squig hoppers. You know you want to. Reistance is futile.

That and Savage Orc Warbosses. You can have them on Chariots or Wyverns. I think you should have one on a wyvern. It makes tem really very hard indeed. Okay so he is going to die 99% of the time, but its fun fun fun.

Taking a moment to be serious. How competative are you making the army? Is it a tournie list, gt any idea of theme or anything like that. Its a rather open army to just name ideas. But I have named my favourite two ideas, so there you go :D. I can imagine a Orcy army paited by yourself will look F-A-B capin'. I want an Orcy army. But allas, I have no time, no funds and no desire to paint it. Even if I was going to paint them red.

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Post by Gnosis »

The more classic ones I use are Martog's Best Basha and Amulet of Protectyness on a BSB, and Wollopa's One Hit Wunda with Bigged's Kicking Boots on a Big Boss. I've recently had smashingly good success using Shaga's Screaming Sword as well, but that had a lot to do with the small size of the board (every single turn of combat his three characters were within 12").
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Post by Khel »

In a Battle report a few months back, Lizzy's vs Orc and Goblins, it was 4000 points, and one of his Orc warbosses had shaga's screaming sword, and the lizzies had all 6 characters within 12' through out the whole battle. Orcs won, and the warboss had Strength 10 and 10 attacks through out the battle.
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Post by Shadow dark »

Not to mention the wyvern. But that was a bit lucky.
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Post by Dark Alliance »

Marauder Mitch2 wrote:
A good idea is the TVI army idea.

.


What is this? :shock:

No real theme as such. I like the idea of a hard combat horde, but also of a fast, mounted Goblin army :lol: I'll probably end up with a mix. It needs to be tourney profficient though. Problem is the list offers too much choice...

The decisions I have made so far are thus:

A unit of Night Goblins with Fanatics. A 'no-brainer' I know but the obvious choice. I have nearly finished painting this unit now and am pleased with the outcome. I've put full command into it and I'm using the previous Goblin models. I hate the new ones so much!

Night Goblin Shaman. This is painted too and was also a figure I already had. Obvious where he will sit in a game ;)

I'm going to have a unit of 9 NG Squig Hoppers. These are just great and will help flush those pesky tree huggers out. I had a couple of figures in my bit box already and have painted a sample which I'm pleased with.

I have an old female Orc figure that my son picked up at Salute a few years ago. I've converted it into a shaman by adding a staff (with the severed head of a Slann on the top) and some skulls etc. Nearly finished the paint job on this too.

My first actual purchase will be a unit of Spider Riders which I see endless use for. 10 figures in box gives me 2 units. Even better!

The only other decision I've made is to have a unit of the new plastic Black Orcs when they're released.
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Post by Rasputinii »

Then it sounds like you need a right 'ard Savage Orc Warboss in a chariot mate. You know you want those four boar attacks, two spear attacks and your 5 attack Orc Warlord. Unless you are going magic heavy I guess. Makes me want and Orc army.

TVI is a member of the Warhammer Empire, short for "The Village Idiot". Famed for playing with huge infantry armies with mounted characters (in 6th). Like 200 model 2k armies. I'm still intrigued by the reference, since it implies hes doing an Orc army and I woul like to see that. Hes a yank incase you are wondering. Won a good few GTs and tournies and stuff like that over the years. Paints his armies really perty too.
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Post by Dark Alliance »

Ant wrote:I got a couple (all untested though so far of course).

Gobbo wizards on chariots first. 2 reasons; 1) They don't take animosity on a chariot so will always be able to cast. 2) The chariots don't take up a special choice. And if they get knocked off they can just join another chariot.

How can they do that?

Similar point for savage orcs on chariots. Frenzied T5 tuskgor chariots with a T5 character on are quite hard...

2 hand weapons are always a good idea too, especially with big uns. 2 S5 attacks (3 for savage orcs) is not to be sniffed at.

All this is ok but with animosit and a slow march...not so sure yet about Orcs

Savage orcs with Gork's warbanner. Similar to witch elves with banner of murder. Since frenzied charges are made after measuring you roll the extra distance before you choose what to charge.

This idea I like a lot

If you don't like te last combo try black orcs with Gork's warbanner. They'll always get the extra d6 bonus when you call Waaagh so if you use both Waaagh and the banner in the same turn you have a charge range of 2d6+8 with an infantry unit!

And this of course!! :twisted:

If you go for a wizard lord 1) Go for an orc, and 2) Give him some sort of magic weapon. With the right kit these guys can be almost as dangerous as a fighty lord.

Oh, and there's the suicide gobbo with wollopa's one hit wunda and the thing that blows up when he's killed. Put him on a wolf and charge him at something. He'll die but he's a gobbo worth next to nothing and should take out a fair bit if you're lucky.

That's about all I can think of for now. Other than the obvious (this banner is great, fanatics do this etc) which I'm sure you don't need to hear).
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Post by Dark Alliance »

RasputinII wrote:Then it sounds like you need a right 'ard Savage Orc Warboss in a chariot mate. You know you want those four boar attacks, two spear attacks and your 5 attack Orc Warlord. Unless you are going magic heavy I guess. Makes me want and Orc army.

See, this kind of stuff I hadn't thought about. I like the lack of stupidity but animosity is an unknown, due in part to the lack of greenskin armies out there I suppose. I haven't got the book with me right now, but do frenzied troops still take animosity??

TVI is a member of the Warhammer Empire, short for "The Village Idiot". Famed for playing with huge infantry armies with mounted characters (in 6th). Like 200 model 2k armies.

Now this I like too, kinda picks up on my character in unit idea I was muting for DEs except I lack the fear causing possibilities. It makes for a good looking army though and of course the mounted orcs fit perfectly with the foot orc base sizes for neatness.

What do people think to Black Orc Warbosses?


I'm still intrigued by the reference, since it implies hes doing an Orc army and I woul like to see that. Hes a yank incase you are wondering. Won a good few GTs and tournies and stuff like that over the years. Paints his armies really perty too.
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Post by Rasputinii »

Frenzied troops do still take Animosity. However chariots don't. Which makes them doubley useful in my mind. And they don't take special slots if bought as characters mounts. All the more reason for the Savage warboss in chariot. Easily screened when needed to be. Would work wonders tag teamed with your Black Orcs. Potential for some great Convos as well.

As for Boars in infantry. I see so reason not to. Its +2 Save and looks awsome. Not to mention a healthy S5 attack on the charge. And the cost can always be ofset against that extra orc you don't have to buy as a result. Of course if you want a GW you might not want the boar.

The Black Orc Warboss. Not really to sure. You pay a bit extra for the abiity to kill your own troops and be armed to da teef. Oh and the extra WS. Personally I like the Savage variety. Cheaper, extra attack, more attacks for the mount too. Its more worth it now Orcs can't get amazing armour saves or amazing magic armours. Though I do keep banging on About Savage Orcs in Chariots.
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Post by Dark Alliance »

What do you think to their magic items? For the most part they don't look too impressive to me at all!

Also, unless I'm missing something, the only way to get those Goblin banners is via a Goblin BSB, is that right?
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Post by Draknir »

Yes, only a Goblin can carry a Goblin banner.

if i'd play O&G, I'd mount my general, who'd be black orc, onto a Ironback Boar. (A mechanical boar that causes impact hits when charging) then i'd arm him with Martog's Best Basha and Spiteful Shield.
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Post by Bloodtemplar »

The units to stay away from are the standard goblins and most varieties of big uns. Goblins are just overshadowed by Night Goblins and Orcs and have no place in a 7th ed army. Big Un upgrade is terribly expensive and the only unit I would consider for it are Savage Orc Boar Boyz which would give them 4 S5 attacks per model on the charge. It sounds good but the price you pay for it is very high and the unit unreliable. However, thinking of upgrading any other type of orc is folly. I'm tempted to add Snotlings to this list too as I see absolutely no use for them in their current form but have no experience in using them in this edition yet.

Everything else in the book goes, especially in a relaxed environment.

I cannot emphasize enough how good the Akrit Axe really is and it really shines with the Kickin' Boots. Effigy of Mork on a Black Orc Warboss is all the protection he'll need in addition to his normal armour save. It's all about the fighty lords now, forget great shamans as you can use both spell lists with low levels anyway and the miscast table is the most destructive ever seen in Warhammer. Last game a single miscast on turn 2 caused the deaths of some 20 greenskins including both my shamans. Don't ask.

I did get excited about the chariot talk with SO Warboss and Goblin Shamans however... As I already have a few chariots I might just be adding a couple of more and have try with it.
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Post by Icon hack »

Two things first DA: 1. Please let us see these units you're painting up, and 2. look on Ebay for your goblin spider riders. If you're willing to go without the periferal bits, you can easily get the ten from the box set for under $10, under $15 with shipping. In fact, I just got all of the Goblin units that come in the boxed set for $25 + $5 shipping.

Also, I haven't got enough of my goblins done to put them on the table yet, but I don't think the animosity in this edition is all that bad. Orc and Goblin units are cheap enough that you should be able to get a lot of redundancy in your list to counteract this somewhat. And you have the ability to insert a Black Orc Boss into any critical unit to control it. But as I've said, I haven't really dealt with it yet, so maybe it's more of a problem than it seems to me. We all know how Stupidity can lay low the best laid plans.

Magic Items: Seems like Martog's Best Basha is a no-brainer, as is the Staff of Sneaky Stealing, which gives you a two dice swing in the enemy magic phase. Sneaky Skewerer looks like a great goblin weapon, too.
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Post by Dark Alliance »

Magic or combat is a tricky decision sure enough. I like the idea of running around like lunatics beatig the crap out of folks as long as I get enough magic defence.

Tell me guys, what are your opinions on Trolls? I have seen them used to great effect in Chaos armies lately and they seem to be de rigeur around here. I'm thinking about applying that kind of thinking and putting a unit of 4 in my list. Maybe Stone Trolls for the MR2.
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Post by Rasputinii »

I don't know if they changed it in the new Orc book or not, but the big difference between chaos trolls and regular trolls always used to be that 4th attack. Also, from my own point of view, and rare choice not spent on Giants is a waste. I do love giants.
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Post by Prince of arnheim »

I take 7 MEnghil Manhide Manflayers muhahahaha. No one ever expects that.

I also like the Martog's Best Basha on the Orc BSB.

Brimstone Babble on a NG Boss mounted on Giant Squig is another good one.

15 Black Orc Big Uns with the Gorks's Waagh BAnner is good too.

5 Boar Boys with Nogg's Banner of Butchery is just terrible!!!
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Post by Ant »

And if they get knocked off they can just join another chariot.

How can they do that?

Oops, :oops: I meant they can join a unit to avoid being shot, not another chariot.

Funny everyone seems to be suggesting different things, both for magic items and unit choices. Just goes to show how good the new book is; there is almost nothing that will never be taken!

On trolls: As Ras said, the big problem with orc trolls is that they only have 3 attacks. However they are much cheaper (15 pts a model cheaper) so IMO that makes it worth it. And there isn't fierce competition for rare choices either (unless you're a certain person who likes orange and has a Giant fetish!) so they are definitely worth considering. i might even think about a unit of 5; it's only 200pts; 20pts LESS than a unit of 4 chaos trolls. Don't go for stone or river trolls though, MR2 and a 5+ save isn't worth 20pts a model, making the unit cost half as much again.

One quick word of warning about squig hoppers though. When I first saw them I thought they were great. Then I played a game against orcs and realised how much of a liability they could be. Having a random move and being skirmishers means that a clever opponent can play havoc with tactical wheeling charges. And being only T3 with no armour they will break to almost anything if they are charged (I broke them with a unit of brettonian MY on the charge and I even broke them with basic bret bowmen when the squigs charged (I went 1st because of the stakes)). I've not tried them out myself but those 2 games convinced me to take them out of my draft orc list.
Last edited by Ant on Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Prince of arnheim »

Ha I knew what you meant Ant.

I for one think that Shamans should not be anywhere near Chariots in case they flee into impassable terrain. Put your Shaman in a 20 strong Orc unit so it can take a casualy before losing the +1 PD bonus.

Some other thoughts

Ant I must say that your news on the Squig Hoppers is alarming. I am considering having a unit of 7 in my list. This would make for a rather wide unit and from what you've said it could to lead to all sort of overruns into my infantry which is never good.

Perhaps the best for them is harassing a flank away from the main body of the army?

Skrimish screens definetly don't work in 7th Edition....sheesh....Skrimishers have been NERff'D!

I have been working on my 2250 list constantly this week. I have come to some important conclusions.

-don't invest too many points inany one ORc or Goblin mage as it coudl just blow up
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Post by Noble korhedron »

You go Mr. Moore! Welcome to the Greenskin ranks, fellow Warboss! But watch out for animosity, it's a real biatch!
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