Host of Karond Kar against the Dark Legion (DE vs DoC)

[Greenbay924]

Hello, played a game of escalation today. My Dark Elves vs his Daemons of Chaos.

My list:

Lords:
Sup. Sorceress - lvl 4, Talisman of Protection, Darkstar Cloak - 330

Heroes:
Lokhir Fellheart - 250
Master - BSB, Pendant of Khaeleth, Heavy Armor, RXB, Beastmaster's scourge, Sea Dragon Cloak - 164

Core:
RXB x20 - standard, musician, shields - 235
RXB x20 - standard, musician, shields - 235
Corsairs x30 - standard, SSS - 335

Special:
Chariot - 100

Rare:
Hydra - 175
Hydra - 175

1999

His list from what I saw:

Daemon Prince - General
Herald of khorne
Herald of tzeench - BSB
Bloodletters x18 w/ standard
Horrors x35, full command, changeling
flamers x5
bloodcrushers x3

We rolled up scenario, and got meeting engagement. After deploying terrain (2 fences, the Elven channeling building, Idol of Gork, marsh, acropolis of heroes) I won the roll to deploy first. I was hoping to lose so I could react to how he deployed, but oh well.

My Deployment:
Rolling for each unit, I had 1 unit of RXB, Lokhir, and a hydra have to come in off the table edge on the first turn.

I picked the side that put the idol of gork and acropolis very far away, and right next to the channeling building. I placed my RXB right behind one of the fences, which was a flaming fence. I put my corairs just to the left of them, about 5 inches from the table edge, so lokhir could join them when he came on. My chariot was placed to the right of the RXB, and the hydra just to the right of the chariot.

His Deployment:
He deployed his large horror block across from the RXB, the bloddcrushers to their right, so in front of the corsairs, his blood letters off to his far left, with the flamers to take on the hydra. Heralds are placed in their respective units, and the daemon prince is placed right behind the horrors. (he didn't have to hold anything in reserve)

MY TURN 1:
No charges, I move the hydra 12' forward towards the bloodletters and flamers, the second hydra comes off the table edge just to the right of the RXB and move up next to them. The other RXB unit comes in off the table edge just left of the corsairs, and moves up next to them. Lokhir comes out and joins the corsairs. The other RXB unit doesn't move, and my sorceress moves to within 6" of the channeling building. The chariot moves closer to the bloodletters and flamers, in hopes of getting a charge off on the flamers next turn.

Magic wasn't great, rolled a 9 + 1 channel + darkstar gave 11 dice, and nothing really needed to be cast yet, he ended up dispelling miasma and enfeebling foe, and I failed to cast the pit of shades.
Shooting saw 1 bloodcrusher drop and 1 wound put on a second from the RXB units.

I passed the turn

HIS TURN 1:
He declares charges with both his bloodcrushers against the corsairs, and the bloodletters against the chariot (didn't realize how close I got to them). Both units had the extra D6 charge range banner, and both made it. Rest of his army stays still, with the daemon prince moving to the front of the horrors.

His magic phase, he casts throne of vines, then tries to bring back the fallen bloodcrusher, not making the roll. His horrors try to flickering fire the hydra, which I dispelled, followed by a gift of chaos, which puts 1 wound on the hydra
His shooting saw the flamers put another wound on the hydra

In combat, the bloodletters deal exactly 4 wounds to the chariot, he makes his restrain roll and faces the hydra. The bloodcrushers were wiped out by the corsairs.

He passed the turn

MY TURN 2:
Hydra declares a charge on the flamers, who are 11 inches away...and rolls double 2s! So no he's sitting there with flank exposed to the bloodletters. Rest of moves, I send the second hydra 12' forward towards the rear of the bloodletters. Caster didn't move, and neither did either RXB unit.

Magic, I tried to get a mindrazor off on the corsairs, threw 7 dice, no double 6s and he just popped his scroll on it.
Shooting, hydra that came off the table dropped its template on the bloodletters killing 7. Both RXB units shot into the daemon prince putting 2 wounds on it.

I passed the turn

HIS TURN 2:
This was a scary turn, he charged the flank of the hydra, charged the daemon prince into the corsairs, then moved the horrors up to about 11" away from my first RXB unit. The flamers marched over to shoot at the other hydra.

Magic was interesting this turn, he tries to cast regrowth on the bloodletters to bring back D6+1 of them, which I dispelled, but then left it open for him to put +4 toughness on them. Though it proved not to matter, at the time I felt this was a big mistake on my part, I should have stopped the toughness.

In shooting he puts 1 wound on the other hydra from the flamers

In combat, he challenges with his daemon prince, I refused as I didn't really want to see my general bite the dust, in combat he killed like 12 corsairs, and in return I did a wound (oh, he was healed up from all the lore of life casting). I lost, but made my steadfast roll. The bloodletters did exactly 3 wounds to finish off the hydra (notice a theme? It keeps going).

He passed the turn.

MY TURN 3:
Noticing that really large horror block so so close to my lines, I swift-reformed the RXB that came in off the table edge and moved them up for a potential flank charge on the horror block. The other RXB didn't move. The other hydra attempts to charge the horrors, needing a 6...and rolls 3! and guess what? Leaves his flank exposed to the bloodletters...Sometimes I hate repetition.

Magic, I was able to get a mindrazor off this turn on the corsairs!

In the shooting phase, all I can do is shoot the flamers with my first RXB unit, and kill one. The other shoots at the horror block, killing maybe 1? Nothing significant.

In combat, I continue to let lokhir chill in the back, once again the daemon prince kills his fair share of corsairs, in return I whiff a little and put 1 wound back on him.

I passed the turn

HIS TURN 3:
The bloodletters charged the flank of the hydra, flamers move to shoot at the first RXB unit.

Magic, this round he casts shield of thorns on the daemon prince, and healed it back to full again. Horrors try to throw some magic missiles, nothing lands.

Shooting, flamers kill 2 RXB

Close combat, this was an important time. His daemon prince again slays 4 more corsairs, but this time I get EXACTLY 4 wounds! So, after it was all said and done, I had 7 corsairs and lokhir left after messing with that daemon prince, would have wiped the unit w/o that mindrazor. The bloodletters do what they did all game, and get EXACTLY 4 wounds on the hydra to kill him. He makes a bad mistake here, and elects to overrun, putting his flank in front of my first RXB unit.

MY TURN 4:
With my corsairs badly beat up and right in front of a massive horror block, I had no choice but to send the archers in! The second RXB unit flanks the horror block, and the other RXB unit flanks the bloodletters. The cast moves out of the range of the channeling building, but close enough to the rest of the force to do something constructive. Corsairs just hung out for a round.

Magic, he manages to roll double 6's to dispel mindrazor, which I threw 9 dice at and no double 6's again.

No shooting this turn as all my missile units have elected to go toe to toe.

In combat, the unit that flanked the bloodletters managed to put 3 wounds on them, and in return lost 1, combat resolution followed by a terrible LD roll wiped out the unit except for the herald. The other RXB unit killed a few horrors, took 1 wound back. They won combat, but with the reroll on the BSB only lost 1. They made the LD test to reform and face the RXB unit.

HIS TURN 4:
No charges were made and nothing moved, as at this point everything was pretty much in combat.

Magic was harsh, he popped some bound spell banner thing to do 3d6 S3 hits to every enemy in base contact with the unit, which I dispelled (oh yeah, he rolled snake eyes this turn for winds, and I channeled so was 2-2).

Shooting, he killed 2 corsairs with the flamers

In combat, the horrors and RXB traded blows, I think he won and I made my LD test to stick around (double 1s at that!) Also, I managed to kill the herald of tzeench. The herald of khorne was finished off.

He passed the turn

MY TURN 5:
The RXB unit that killed the bloodletters charged into the flank of the flamers, I was only 4 1/2 inches away, so no stand and shoot. I decided to send the corsairs into the flank of the horrors (might have been a pretty dumb idea).

In magic, I get off another mindrazor on the corsairs

No shooting again...

On to combat, the changeling makes way to fight against lokhir, which re gets exactly 2 wounds on him, and with lokhir only getting a 6+ save (negated by S4), and no regen ( due to flaming attacks) he fell. But not before taking 4 horrors with him! Between the rest of the corsairs and the RXB, there was massive casualties being dealt, another 8 horrors went down. In return, I lost 4 models between the two units. After combat resolution he had LD1 and rolled an 11, losing 10 more models. (down to 1 rank, 8 wide now)

Flamers get wiped out by the RXB, as I remember to make way with the BSB and overrun 6", about 4" off the rear of the horror block.

I passed the turn

HIS TURN 5:
No movement or shooting as his horrors is all that's left, though this was a scary turn!

In the magic phase, he gets off the bound spell item to do 3D6 S3 hits on everything in base contact, I fail to dispel. (his 6 to my 4). There was only 5 corsairs and 8 RXB left at this time, after the spell there was 2 corsairs and 4 RXB left!

In combat, he moves the changeling back over to fight the RXB unit. I kill 1 horror and lose 1 RXB. Combat was a draw.

MY TURN 6:
Pretty straight forward, charged the other RXB unit into the rear of the horrors.
Magic phase was fast, tried for another mindrazor, was dispelled.

In combat, changeling uses the stats from the BSB to attack the other RXB unit (was in B2B with the back of the changeling) and whiffs on the 3 attacks. In return, the unit is killed down to 1 model.

He extended the hand.

Result:
Massacre for the Dark Elves!

Notes:
This one could have gone either way at plenty of times. Due to some pretty bad save rolls on his part, he lost some key battles (like taking the exact amount to finish off the daemon prince)
His flamers also were pretty bad when rolling the number of shots, when he had 5 he rolled 14 shots on average, it actually went up after he lost 1!
Hydras were a huge disappointment, granted it was due to some pretty bad charge rolling.
I was most upset over losing the chariot before getting to charge with it, as I went out and bought the Geiger Dragon model from Valiant Miniatures yesterday, went home and put it together and painted it just to use as my chariot (counts as). Part of the fluff of the army is a raiding force to capture slaves, not all of which are humanoid. In this case, it's a captured drake being forced into war. Still have to add some chains and slavers mushing it along, should be cool when done.

MVP of the match:
Sorceress with the two clutch mindrazors, could have also gone to the RXB for holding their own in combat (granted, against pretty favorable match ups). Those mindrazors were too huge though.

LVP (least valuable player) is the first hydra, followed closely by the second hydra. Only thing they really did was keep the bloodletters busy early on. Not really what I expect from them! But I know going into this game, the hydras werent going to do much, with all the flaming attacks he has.

Anyway, sorry for ANOTHER report with no pictures, makes it hard to follow and if any of you made it this far in the reading, I commend your attention spans! One of these days I'll buy a camera to take when gaming.

Anyway, hope you enjoyed the read.

[xFallenx]

Awesome. Thanks for the write up. Sorry about the Hydra's, what would you use instead or would you just use them differently?

[Greenbay924]

They just had some bad luck, if the first one would have made the charge against the horrors, it could have overrun far enough so the bloodletters couldn't charge it. Then I could have taken on that bloodletter group with both.

This edition, the hydras aren't as big of a power house as people seem to think, yes they do some damage, but against anything with a rank, it's almost pointless. I can kill the maximum possible number of models - 31 (7 attacks + 6 handlers + 12 breathweapon + 6 stomp) and still not be able to break a unit with 36 or more, as they're steadfast.

It's almost worth dropping to bring something else to the fight, the best use I have for them now is to tarpit their tarpit.

They're still really good, I just don't think people should cry foul when they see one on the table. I love the models though, and if they were stuck with the ugly last edition ones, I doubt I'd use them!

[Masamune]

Nice report, thanks for that!

And yes, add in pictures. I am from the internets and can't be bothered to read!

I think the hydra dilemma is something a lot of DE are facing lately. It seems to often be the case that if one is useless the second is as well. For this reason, I've switched to making single hydra lists recently. Unquestioningly it's a great value for points unit but it's certainly not so overpowered or game breaking as you'd think from some people's reactions.

[Greenbay924]

I'll get a game in on Thursday where I'll take notes and try to get some pictures, they'll be semi low quality, but better than nothing I guess.

[xFallenx]

Having not played much of 6th or any of 7th, I had never used a Hydra. I have played two games in 8th to date, both times to great effect.

I find that they are amazing in support with the breath weapon and thunder stomp. The weakness of the hydra, in my limited experience, is that the toughness scales with its wounds making it better as support as opposed to being supported.

I ran it on the opposite flank as my knights in order to draw the eyes of my enemies away from either the Hydra or the Knights.
Both the Armies I played were pretty shooty (WE & Rats) and the trick worked, drawing all fire towards the Hydra leaving my knights to wreak havoc in behind the lines.

People really are still scared of that beast.