WTF Alith Anar

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cultofkhaine
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WTF Alith Anar

Post by cultofkhaine »

I am quite a novice player and still finding my way around the rules of this great game, anyway I had a game today and came across this character for the first time.

We were a couple of rounds into the game (Me playing Dark Elves and my opponent High Elves), I was kicking arse and more or less had the game in the bag won until I encountered Alith Anar.

I had a unit of 20 BG that had been cut down to 11 by his archers when they made a successful charge against the lone character. Alith had the option to stand and shoot at my on coming charge - fine.

He has an attack of 4 at BS 7, so immediately all four hit, no roll to hit required.

Rolling to Wound my BG have toughness 3, based on S7 attacks which means he needs to roll 2+ to wound - all four dice successfully wound, no armour saves allowed.

Now here is the big WTF moment, because Alith has "The Moonbow" he gets multiple wounds D3

We rolled a dice for each wound, he rolled 5/6s so essentially he has now delt 12 wounds total obliterating my unit of 11 Black Guard :killed: I didn't even get into close combat

I looked at these rules for half an hour in disbelief before we could progress the game. We then continued and he steadily bit by bit decimated my remaining troops across the board with this one character. :cry:

Have I interpreted these rules correctly - would love some one to be able to confirm if I have this correct or not.

Also how do I kill the bugger.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Red... »

No, he screwed you. Multi wound attacks (e.g. D3 or d6) only apply against multi wound models (eg heros and lords). Against one wound models each attack does just 1 wound and the others are wasted, so 4 wounding attacks do a max of 4 kills, not 12.

It should be in the main rule book, in special rules.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by cultofkhaine »

Thanks red for the quick reply.

That sounds so much better - I have been scratching my head thinking how can a unit like that do so much damage.

I will go back and check that rule now - this easily cost me the game.

Oh well it's all a learning experience at the moment - Cheers
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Red... »

No worries :) Otherwise a cannon (d6 multiple wounds) hitting 5 models could do up to 30 kills!
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Haagrum »

Red has correctly stated the rules point.

Also, unless his rules state otherwise, Alith Anar shoots like a bolt thrower but doesn't get one shot for each Attack on his profile. Consider it further proof of the degenerate ways of the Asur.

As for how to kill Alith Anar - he's T3, with a lousy armour save and only a -1 to hit with shooting and a 4+ ward to protect him. He's no great shakes in close combat. If you can catch him with a half-decent combat unit, he's dead (although he does have Swiftstride). Cut down his escort and make him flee, or target him in particular if you have enough Attacks to throw at him. Alternately, blast him/his unit with magic missiles.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Payce »

Or simply death magic snipes.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Khaleth Blackheart »

Got the rules in front of me now, he shoots like a bolt thrower but with strength 7 and quick to fire.
Also the multiple wounds part of it have no effect against one wound models.
He's not particularly good in close combat, so cloak of twilight peg master would easily take him.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Thraundil »

In addition, a roll of 1 is always always always a failure, so with BS7 at short range - he still needs to roll a 2+ to hit you. But yeah, by the sound of it your opponent screwed you over royally, hopefully not intentionally, although it would seem prudent to know what multiple wounds special rule means when you have models with it. You can never ever inflict more wounds to a model than it has on its profile - the only exception is overkill in challenges. So yeah, he should have killed max 4 of your guys, and you should have then cut him to pieces. If you really had the game in a good spot at this point in time I think it would be safe for you to contact your opponent and claim victory by faulty play right there. 7 black guard would have brutally murdered him, thats 10 (incl supporting) attacks hitting at 4's with rerolls for a total of 7,5 hits. At 3+ to wound and rerolling 1's you're looking at a real good chance to instantly pop the guy in first round, or at least in combat round 2.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by cultofkhaine »

Thanks Guys for your input - so many rules, still getting my head around this game. Plenty of fun learning it.

Alith Anar shoots like a bolt thrower but doesn't get one shot for each Attack on his profile


@Haagrum - are you saying that all those attacks should be directed at one model - or is it correct in say that it can be spread to four models.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Taijushue »

Alith Anar only gets 1 shooting attack, the 4 attacks on his profile are just for CC. The only way to get multiple shots from a single model is with a special rule.

His bow is a bolt thrower though so he would hit the first rank at S7, if he wounds he goes to rank 2 at S6 and so on until he fails to wound or runs out of ranks.

so with your 11 BG depending on the width he would have only been able to kill 2 or 3.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Haagrum »

Cultofkhaine wrote:Thanks Guys for your input - so many rules, still getting my head around this game. Plenty of fun learning it.

Alith Anar shoots like a bolt thrower but doesn't get one shot for each Attack on his profile


@Haagrum - are you saying that all those attacks should be directed at one model - or is it correct in say that it can be spread to four models.


What I'm saying is that Alith Anar gets one shot in each of his shooting phases (and as a Stand and Shoot reaction). One, and only one. You resolve that shot as though it's a bolt thrower hitting at S7, so it can pierce ranks, but it can never kill 11 models.

Taijushue's response accurately reflects the actual rules and the situation which should have followed the Black Guard unit's charge.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by direweasel »

So yeah, to summarize, you got screwed over pretty hard

- The models "A" value doesn't apply to shooting.
- You ALWAYS have to roll to hit (unless a special rule specifically states otherwise) because 1's always fail
- d3 wounds are done PER MODEL, so 1-wound minis just get wounded once.

We can HOPE that your opponent was simply ignorant of the proper rules. You should immediately rectify that. Going back to "fix" the battle is usually not how things work, you live and learn with mistakes that were made. It's not like it was a tournament environment anyway.

The game is complex, but that's because it has to be. Warfare is a messy business, any wargame that's oversimplified is no fun and loses all illusion of realism. Then you throw in different races, and items, and magic, and all kinds of room for confusion abounds. Just learn as you go and get better going forward - that's all anybody can do. :)
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by T.D. »

direweasel wrote:So yeah, to summarize, you got screwed over pretty hard


THIS.

Alith Anar shoots with one shot. That one shot is a bolt thrower so penetrates ranks. I'm guessing you had two ranks, so max of two guys could die(!)

i.e.
- you declare charge
- he declares stand and shoot
- Alith fires a single shot, opponent rolls to hit (1s can fail); {see rules for bolt throwers in the BRB}
- if it hits = it hits one rank and file black guard, roll to wound
- if it wounds, BG dies and it continues on to 2nd rank
- now S6, roll to wound, etc
- you don't panic so complete the charge
- proceed to tear Alith a new one (he can attack four times now with his melee weapon at his Initiative and WS, as it's close combat).
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Rabidnid »

As noted above, he is just a fairly soft lord level hero with a really big bow that shoots 36" like a S-7 bolt thrower. He has hatred versus DE and a DE unit suffers a -1 to their leadership to the end of the phase if they suffer a wound from the bow.
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Dalamar »

He also gets Unbreakable from the Banner of Naggarythe ;)
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Re: WTF Alith Anar

Post by Saintofm »

I beleive most things that can cause multiple wounds on a unit expressly say so or say its an extra attack of sorts like 2X repeating fire from a repeater crossbow or a brace of pistotles (or in the case of some warmachines like Helguns and Gobla spewer, roll to see how many hits they get in).

Also the multiple wounds things comes in AFTER SAVES so it has to sucsessfuly wound someone first before you find out how badly it mangles them.
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