Are there Power Builds for Druchii?

[Kurt_wulfraign]

The title says it all. Are there any Power Builds (or maybe units) in the 8th edition army?

I just read it somewhere by Meteor (army list I think) about certain Power Builds (he metioned ASF Cold Ones and some other stuff). I was now wondering if their are really Super Heavy Power Builds for us.

cheers;
Kurt

[Norngahl]

The title says it all. Are there any Power Builds (or maybe units) in the 8th edition army?

I just read it somewhere by Meteor (army list I think) about certain Power Builds (he metioned ASF Cold Ones and some other stuff). I was now wondering if their are really Super Heavy Power Builds for us.

cheers;
Kurt

For chars its

Dreadlord, Heavy Armor, Seedragoncloak, Shield, Soulrender, Pendant of Kaeleth, Crown of Command, Dragonhelm.
-> Smash it into the nastiest enemy unit and bind it for the whole game. Beside you trap it, slowly bring it down. Nasty unit to block out? Take him. THE Dreadlord Combo at the moment.

Otherwise a
Supreme Sorcress, Talisman of Perservation, Dagger of Hotek, Ironcurse Icon and Death Magic in a 25 man unit spears with shields and full command and the banner of discipline. Together with a Level 2 with Deathmagic on Pegasus and with a Powerscroll. This gives you usually 7 Power Dices from Winds of Magic (4:3), 5 from the Dagger, 2 from the Power of Darkness of the Supreme, 1 from the PoD from the Lvl2, sometimes +1 from channeling and +X when they kill enmies by spells due to lore attribute. With A purple sun going auto-off with 7 dices (large version with powerscroll), it gives you 12 dices back due to the lore attribute. Meanwhile the Lvl4 snipes everything with LD10 + signature spell+ drop enemy LD by 3 spell or with Lanip, breaks down enemies S/T -1. This is just the most insane magic build out there beside a slann. It even ashames Teclis due to it´s large damage output. This is my current septup It´s almost a real autowin button and won´t make you much friends.

The dagger works fine for shadow as well, but Lvl2 flying auto-sun and repleneshing PD pool works best with Deathmagic. Really nasty.


If you can´t efford the Dreadlord (because you play under 3k and want to play the Magic mentioned above) you might like the
Noble, Heavy Armor, Shield, Seedragoncloak, Dark Pegasus, BSB, Sword of Might and Pendant of Kaeleth. He is pretty much the same build as the upper Dreadlord, but the only thing is that you have to shove him into the flank of a unit rather than beeing capable of putting him into the front. He isn´t that reliable against passive boni as the Dreadlord, but that´s why he is 1/3 cheaper. Anyhow, great alternative if you can´t take the Dreadlord.

Another nice thing is a cauldron BSB + MSU with khainites.. Works pretty good, even better with shadow magic support ( 7 Witches with Mindrazor and +1 attack from the cauldron have 28 hatred-attacks with strengh 8.. thats mean..). Same goes for executioners when the enemy gets Ini1 through miasma while they are granted +1 attack from the cauldron. Nice as well. Not that powerfull as the Death-Magic build, but also nice.


Most combos are good because they have some magic and/or cauldron support or are just pure magic combos.
For example 10 Knights with FC, Banner of Hag Graef, Ring of Hotek, +1 attack from the cauldron and -1T through a Death/Shadow spell do some real harm even to the most badass units.

[Masked jackal]

Not so much power builds, as a flexible and powerful army list. We don't really need to rely on something so mundane as a 'power-list'. There are plenty of power-builds for certain units, but as for lists, you can field a good combination of any of these any way you want. All power-lists, by a certain logic, but leaves you room to experiment. =)

[Madrid69]

why is the banner of hag graef actually needed on the CoK??
I've seen other people using it on Black Guard too.
They both have I6, that's as much as most other armies' heroes. Why the banner?

[Blaznak]

ASF is really pretty cool stuff. It lets you counter against High Elves, for one, and if you beat your opponent's initiative, you get a reroll to hit in rounds 2+ of combat.
~B~

[Norngahl]

why is the banner of hag graef actually needed on the CoK??
I've seen other people using it on Black Guard too.
They both have I6, that's as much as most other armies' heroes. Why the banner?

While BG has Ini6 and always reroll through warrior elite, most people don´t take the banner of hag graef anymore, as the only bonus is striking equally with high elves, but against anyone else you waste it´s effect.

For example CoK get ASF AND the reroll out of it, which is a huge advantage for them, as they need to break trough enemy units as fast as possible.

You can also take the flaming banner on the CoK. In this case they will do very good against troops with regeneration (trolls, undead elite blocks, hydras, hellpits and so on) but you should either have a cauldron to back them up with +1 attack to cover up the reroll loss, or you should have a very decent magic to kill chars that would hurt them like hell or of course just magic to support them (for example: shadow with miasma to make it harder for the enemy to hit and easier for you to hit, downgrade of 1-3T by the enemy when the CoK couldn´t break them, as they are now only strengh 4, mindrazor and so on...)

[Ehakir]

Dagger of Hotek = Sacrificial Dagger

But otherwise, yeah you are right. The lord is nasty, the sorceress combination is nasty. Besides, fielding dual hydra's is nasty, though not unbeatable

[Dangerous Beans]

Supreme Sorcress
Power Scroll, Black Dragon Egg, Pendent
Level 4
Pegasus

Give her death, fly her forwards 20", sit on the enemy's flank, use power scroll on purple sun and watch it wipe out whole armies of ogres, lizardmen etc. In their turn, use the Black Dragon Egg is needed (spells or missile fire likely)

Not very fair in my opinion as theres little you can do to stop it.

[Damienhell]

Kurt[/quote]

For chars its

Dreadlord, Heavy Armor, Seedragoncloak, Shield, Soulrender, Pendant of Kaeleth, Crown of Command, Dragonhelm.
-> Smash it into the nastiest enemy unit and bind it for the whole game. Beside you trap it, slowly bring it down. Nasty unit to block out? Take him. THE Dreadlord Combo at the moment.
.[/quote]

Isn't the soulrender a great weapon (require 2 hands), and thus you can't use shield with it?

[Dark reaper]

You get an additional point of armour versus shooting.

[Norngahl]

You get an additional point of armour versus shooting.

Jup, 0+ vs shooting and 2+ in CC plus the pendant wardsave. Not even a cannon ball can stop him. And the loss of Ini is irrelevant, as he has 2+AS and 2-3+WS against everything you throw him into. Just worth the rending S6 attacks

[Dark reaper]

On the other hand, when wearing the helm, the shield is probably useless as you can never have better than a 1+ armour save.

[Norngahl]

If something (magical item, spell) destroys your helm, pendant or weapon or simply negates it´s effect in base2base you are happy for another armor save point.

[Dark reaper]

I can see the point if something destroys your helm. In hand to hand however, you cannot use the shield anyway.

[Norngahl]

I can see the point if something destroys your helm. In hand to hand however, you cannot use the shield anyway.

Unless something destroys your weapon. But for 3 lousy bucks, I make sure my DL lasts longer in such a situation Nontheless it´s of course up to you.

[Masked jackal]

Just replace Dragonhelm with Whip of Agony. It gives you the same deal, takes away the ASL, and gives you an extra attack.

[Norngahl]

It makes the build vulnerable to metal magic sniper spells and takes away 1 strengh and 1 armor save.

With an unkillable model, it doesn´t matter if you strike last. But strengh 6 matters against knights or monsters or characters and such nastys where he is supposed to be. The same goes for the AS.

Whip isn´t a good weapon as there are always better weapons or mundane weapons for much cheaper. If you really feel you have to take it, take it on your 4. sorceress, as she benefits the most of it lol.

[Soulshade]

Meanwhile the Lvl4 snipes everything with LD10 + signature spell+ drop enemy LD by 3 spell or with Lanip, breaks down enemies S/T -1.

Not quite right. The spell spirit leech says you use the unmodified LD values. So no +1 for you or -3 for them.

[C_freman]

Whip isn´t a good weapon as there are always better weapons or mundane weapons for much cheaper. If you really feel you have to take it, take it on your 4. sorceress, as she benefits the most of it lol.

I'm sorry, but I completely disagree... A single hand weapon (you can use your shield) that gives +1A, S5 (no matter what hexes or abilities the enemy has) and AP is quite a bargain for 25pts... Just to compare, +1A costs us 15pts, and 20pts for many other armies...

I'm not saying it's the best choice for any character, but it isn't a bad weapon choice at all, specially if you want to give that RoH pegasus bearer with a 2+/1+ AS without using magical armours.

[Masked jackal]

It makes the build vulnerable to metal magic sniper spells and takes away 1 strengh and 1 armor save.

I went through the rulebook, and yeah, great weapons now give +2S, so you gain a strength, but Metal magic isn't used that much, at least in my area, and if it is, just play more conservatively. And you don't lose an armor save either, as you can use the shield in close combat then.

With an unkillable model, it doesn´t matter if you strike last. But strengh 6 matters against knights or monsters or characters and such nastys where he is supposed to be. The same goes for the AS.

The extra attack mitigates this. S5 is pretty ideal for everything you'll face, and even with knights getting a 5+ save, you'll still cut through them pretty cleanly.

Whip isn´t a good weapon as there are always better weapons or mundane weapons for much cheaper. If you really feel you have to take it, take it on your 4. sorceress, as she benefits the most of it lol.

I dare you to find a weapon that gets you S5, AP, +1A in a one-handed package for cheaper. You could combine magical items for about 50 or so points to get the Whip, if you wanted.

[Norngahl]

It makes the build vulnerable to metal magic sniper spells and takes away 1 strengh and 1 armor save.

I went through the rulebook, and yeah, great weapons now give +2S, so you gain a strength, but Metal magic isn't used that much, at least in my area, and if it is, just play more conservatively. And you don't lose an armor save either, as you can use the shield in close combat then.

Okay, so you take the risk of being vulnerable to metal magic. That´s your decision, I rather like to have a dreadlord invulnerable to that. But here you say you take a shield in CC to replace the AS bonus the helmet gave you.

With an unkillable model, it doesn´t matter if you strike last. But strengh 6 matters against knights or monsters or characters and such nastys where he is supposed to be. The same goes for the AS.

The extra attack mitigates this. S5 is pretty ideal for everything you'll face, and even with knights getting a 5+ save, you'll still cut through them pretty cleanly.

Actually there are worlds between S5 and S6. It really matters if you wound a dragon on 4+ rather than 5+, or if you wound rank and file on 2+ rather than 3+. Also you don´t get an extra attack with the shield. If you go for the extra attack, you loose the AS bonus instead. So your math doesn´t work, you can´t choose wether to use the shield or the handweapon instead. Also you speak about knights with a 2+ AS. Ever fought chaos knights or such stuff? With T4-5 you are still way better off with +1 Strengh rather than an additional attack (and you don´t just loose 1 strengh for the +1 attack, but also 1 AS point, 2 AS points if you count the shield AND the missing helmet). So when you use the Whip with a hand weapon, you only get a 4+ AS in CC, 3+ if on a mount. The helmet + GW build gives you a 2+ AS, S6 for the exchange of one lousy attack. What does an additional attack help when it´s equally killy due to lower strengh while loosing an AS point and flaming attacks protection?!

Whip isn´t a good weapon as there are always better weapons or mundane weapons for much cheaper. If you really feel you have to take it, take it on your 4. sorceress, as she benefits the most of it lol.

I dare you to find a weapon that gets you S5, AP, +1A in a one-handed package for cheaper. You could combine magical items for about 50 or so points to get the Whip, if you wanted.

There is no need for a single handed weapon, when you still get the same AS, be nearly invulnerable to flaming attacks of any kind AND get +1 strengh. Sure the Whip has many boni and is cheap for what it does. But there are still combos that do way better than spending points on such builds.

[Flash29]

It makes the build vulnerable to metal magic sniper spells and takes away 1 strengh and 1 armor save.

I went through the rulebook, and yeah, great weapons now give +2S, so you gain a strength, but Metal magic isn't used that much, at least in my area, and if it is, just play more conservatively. And you don't lose an armor save either, as you can use the shield in close combat then.

Okay, so you take the risk of being vulnerable to metal magic. That´s your decision, I rather like to have a dreadlord invulnerable to that. But here you say you take a shield in CC to replace the AS bonus the helmet gave you.

With an unkillable model, it doesn´t matter if you strike last. But strengh 6 matters against knights or monsters or characters and such nastys where he is supposed to be. The same goes for the AS.

The extra attack mitigates this. S5 is pretty ideal for everything you'll face, and even with knights getting a 5+ save, you'll still cut through them pretty cleanly.

Actually there are worlds between S5 and S6. It really matters if you wound a dragon on 4+ rather than 5+, or if you wound rank and file on 2+ rather than 3+. Also you don´t get an extra attack with the shield. If you go for the extra attack, you loose the AS bonus instead. So your math doesn´t work, you can´t choose wether to use the shield or the handweapon instead. Also you speak about knights with a 2+ AS. Ever fought chaos knights or such stuff? With T4-5 you are still way better off with +1 Strengh rather than an additional attack (and you don´t just loose 1 strengh for the +1 attack, but also 1 AS point, 2 AS points if you count the shield AND the missing helmet). So when you use the Whip with a hand weapon, you only get a 4+ AS in CC, 3+ if on a mount. The helmet + GW build gives you a 2+ AS, S6 for the exchange of one lousy attack. What does an additional attack help when it´s equally killy due to lower strengh while loosing an AS point and flaming attacks protection?!

Whip isn´t a good weapon as there are always better weapons or mundane weapons for much cheaper. If you really feel you have to take it, take it on your 4. sorceress, as she benefits the most of it lol.

I dare you to find a weapon that gets you S5, AP, +1A in a one-handed package for cheaper. You could combine magical items for about 50 or so points to get the Whip, if you wanted.

There is no need for a single handed weapon, when you still get the same AS, be nearly invulnerable to flaming attacks of any kind AND get +1 strengh. Sure the Whip has many boni and is cheap for what it does. But there are still combos that do way better than spending points on such builds.

I'd like to note that the whip is now a 1 handed weapon that confers +1 attack and ap on all attacks made not a additional hand weapon that makes all attacks st 5 ap so you use it in conjuction with a shield in close combat.

also there are to my knowledge only 3 1+ as knights in the game, these being chaos knights, and the knigtly orders/ knights of the inner realm from the empire. and the last will usually have a 2+as in combat as they are now more popular with great weapons.

Although i like protection against lore of metal if running in a unit it's usually not needed and lore of metal spells are either the magic missile which is limited in range, casting diff and line of sight or the bad direct damage spell.

The whip is a exellent weapon although maybe not on the stubborn dreadlord as lore of metal can 1 shot him and uberunits almost every army has flaming banner in it meaning you can even keep up things like witch elves or comparible units.

[Jbtheslipperking]

5x30 spears fc. Hell of a paint job, but not many armies that can efectively counter it. Thats 1000p that will take alot of work to take out thats for sure.
And as said, we don`t need power builds, no fun in that.

[Norngahl]

5x30 spears fc. Hell of a paint job, but not many armies that can efectively counter it. Thats 1000p that will take alot of work to take out thats for sure.
And as said, we don`t need power builds, no fun in that.

Just armies with breath and template weapons.. so everyone and his mother

[Malmorte]

[quote="Norngahl"][quote="Kurt_Wulfraign"]The title says it all. Are there any Power Builds (or maybe units) in the 8th edition army?

I just read it somewhere by Meteor (army list I think) about certain Power Builds (he metioned ASF Cold Ones and some other stuff). I was now wondering if their are really Super Heavy Power Builds for us.

cheers;
Kurt[/quote]

For chars its

Dreadlord, Heavy Armor, Seedragoncloak, Shield, Soulrender, Pendant of Kaeleth, Crown of Command, Dragonhelm.
-> Smash it into the nastiest enemy unit and bind it for the whole game. Beside you trap it, slowly bring it down. Nasty unit to block out? Take him. THE Dreadlord Combo at the moment.

Otherwise a
Supreme Sorcress, Talisman of Perservation, Dagger of Hotek, Ironcurse Icon and Death Magic in a 25 man unit spears with shields and full command and the banner of discipline. Together with a Level 2 with Deathmagic on Pegasus and with a Powerscroll. This gives you usually 7 Power Dices from Winds of Magic (4:3), 5 from the Dagger, 2 from the Power of Darkness of the Supreme, 1 from the PoD from the Lvl2, sometimes +1 from channeling and +X when they kill enmies by spells due to lore attribute. With A purple sun going auto-off with 7 dices (large version with powerscroll), it gives you 12 dices back due to the lore attribute. Meanwhile the Lvl4 snipes everything with LD10 + signature spell+ drop enemy LD by 3 spell or with Lanip, breaks down enemies S/T -1. This is just the most insane magic build out there beside a slann. It even ashames Teclis due to it´s large damage output. This is my current septup It´s almost a real autowin button and won´t make you much friends.

The dagger works fine for shadow as well, but Lvl2 flying auto-sun and repleneshing PD pool works best with Deathmagic. Really nasty.


If you can´t efford the Dreadlord (because you play under 3k and want to play the Magic mentioned above) you might like the
Noble, Heavy Armor, Shield, Seedragoncloak, Dark Pegasus, BSB, Sword of Might and Pendant of Kaeleth. He is pretty much the same build as the upper Dreadlord, but the only thing is that you have to shove him into the flank of a unit rather than beeing capable of putting him into the front. He isn´t that reliable against passive boni as the Dreadlord, but that´s why he is 1/3 cheaper. Anyhow, great alternative if you can´t take the Dreadlord.

Another nice thing is a cauldron BSB + MSU with khainites.. Works pretty good, even better with shadow magic support ( 7 Witches with Mindrazor and +1 attack from the cauldron have 28 hatred-attacks with strengh 8.. thats mean..). Same goes for executioners when the enemy gets Ini1 through miasma while they are granted +1 attack from the cauldron. Nice as well. Not that powerfull as the Death-Magic build, but also nice.


Most combos are good because they have some magic and/or cauldron support or are just pure magic combos.
For example 10 Knights with FC, Banner of Hag Graef, Ring of Hotek, +1 attack from the cauldron and -1T through a Death/Shadow spell do some real harm even to the most badass units.[/quote]


And what would be a nasty army to go with that? obviously a nice big unit 30-40 spears, and two hydras. What else?