New Name for CoK's

Mime · Post by **Mime** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:18 pm

Hey all. Had a bit of a sleppless night last night and as these things do in the wee small hours a rather strange thing hit me. Our Cold one Knights are the only nightly Order that has a description for what they are as their name.

You don't find silver helms called Med-horse Efl-Knights, or Knitghts of the Realm with some inane semi descriptive title. So why have we been lumbered with it?

Would there be any desire as a community to invent our own title for our Heavy Cav? Also would there be any point? I know GW used to accept input form the gaming world but do they still listen?

Phierlihy · Post by **Phierlihy** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:20 pm

Nope to all of the above.

Rabidnid · Post by **Rabidnid** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:22 pm

mime wrote:Hey all. Had a bit of a sleppless night last night and as these things do in the wee small hours a rather strange thing hit me. Our Cold one Knights are the only nightly Order that has a description for what they are as their name.

You don't find silver helms called Med-horse Efl-Knights, or Knitghts of the Realm with some inane semi descriptive title. So why have we been lumbered with it?

Would there be any desire as a community to invent our own title for our Heavy Cav? Also would there be any point? I know GW used to accept input form the gaming world but do they still listen?

That actually seems reasonable. Mine have a lot of names that aren't really printable though, as they are usually related to failed stupidity rolls.

Post by **Drainial** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:23 pm

Cold one knights does fine because no other knights ride cold ones. Dragon knights are so called for the same reason (kind of).

Tethlis · Post by **Tethlis** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:21 pm

Well, Dragon Princes is a societal label amongst High Elf culture. It denotes that they're from Caledor, and that they're Caledorian nobility, even though they don't literally ride dragons.

I think the name "Cold One Knights" isn't quite as literal as it might seem. Sure, they're knights who ride Cold Ones, but fluff-wise there's something else there too. They sacrifice physical sensation and tactile sense in exchange for a powerful, scary dinosaur companion that lets them further their own ambition and battlefield prowess. So "Cold One" refers to their dinosaur, but also refers to their personalities. I can't think of many people who would be willing to sacrifice physical sensation in exchange for heightened social standing and the ability to kick someone's ass more effectively. It's cold, detached, and frankly pretty scary, i.e. "Cold One" refers to the rider as well as the mount.

Post by **Drainial** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:51 pm

That is why I said kind of (my mistake on the knights/prince thing though), now it is a label given to Caledorian nobles but it is based on the fact that they used to ride dragons en mass back in the good old days.

It is entirely possible for there to be orders of knights within dark elf society, although there are no mentions of such. You only have to look at other armies to see that generic labels are all the rage in the army books. Chaos knights is a blanket term but there we knew that there are plenty of individual war bands and even the odd knightly order. Boar riders, Cold one riders (LM), It seems to me that only in recent books has GW taken to giving them more esoteric names. Brettonians are an exception as they are a knightly army and for the empire they needed something because otherwise they would just be called knights.

Ataroth · Post by **Ataroth** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:47 am

AFAIK aren't Pegasus Knights simply called just that, Pegasus Knights, and they are Brettonians to. Lizardmen have it worse. Their cavalry is called Saurus Cavalry... wonder how they came up with that name. Give that they also ride Cold Ones, I'm quite pleased at the fact that we're the ones who gets to call them Cold One Knights.

Wargamer lester · Post by **Wargamer lester** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:31 pm

Dumb Dinosaur Riders?

Serious: Call the Dread Knights and name the Champion something else.

Mime · Post by **Mime** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:33 pm

Tethlis wrote:Well, Dragon Princes is a societal label amongst High Elf culture. It denotes that they're from Caledor, and that they're Caledorian nobility, even though they don't literally ride dragons.

I think the name "Cold One Knights" isn't quite as literal as it might seem. Sure, they're knights who ride Cold Ones, but fluff-wise there's something else there too. They sacrifice physical sensation and tactile sense in exchange for a powerful, scary dinosaur companion that lets them further their own ambition and battlefield prowess. So "Cold One" refers to their dinosaur, but also refers to their personalities. I can't think of many people who would be willing to sacrifice physical sensation in exchange for heightened social standing and the ability to kick someone's ass more effectively. It's cold, detached, and frankly pretty scary, i.e. "Cold One" refers to the rider as well as the mount.

This.
I hadn't thought about it in this way. Guess I won't be able to think of them as merely having a discriptive name again.

Kudos

Blondshade · Post by **Blondshade** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 5:32 am

our cold one knights area copy of lizardman ones so i support it 100%

i think they should be called rapter riders like the dinosaurs that way theyare like what you said about "Our Cold one Knights are the only nightly Order that has a description for what they are as their name. "

that and rapter jesus is awesome

Post by **Drainial** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 8:09 am

Lizardmen got Coldones a good while after us so it is they who are doing the copying. Also Coldones are not dionsaurs and they certainly are not even remotly raptorish.

Blondshade · Post by **Blondshade** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 1:46 pm

Dinosaur*

how arethey not rapters. they look just like them, here check this link out
http://www.google.com/search?gcx=c&q=ra ... 04&bih=707

i think the cold ones spawn in the southlands and the lizardman sells them to the dark elves for slaves

so if that isnt a good name, how about we call them cold blood killers.

i like this idea

Post by **Drainial** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 2:16 pm

The Malus Darkblade books call Cold ones dragon kin. Not official but in lieu of other evidence telling.

Someone may correct me if I am wrong but I believe that Cold Ones were found in underground caves and are indigenous both to Naggaroth and to Lustria. There are no Cold Ones in the southlands but rather a smaller breed named Horned ones.

As for the raptor thing their heads are too big, their jaws too heavy and they are slower than raptor dinosaurs. They are closer to Carnosuars or Tyrannosaurs in build. But again they are not dinosaurs, just saying.

Also the Lizardmen would certainly never trade with Dark elves, they are not part of the old ones plan and they keep nicking their stuff besides which they have no need of slaves.

Blondshade · Post by **Blondshade** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 3:24 pm

so what do the lizardman do with the dark elves?
i couldve sworn they sold the rapter creatures for slaves but maybe that was an old edition. then since the rapters were in a different environment they evloved differently than the original ones the lizardmen sold

Post by **Drainial** » Mon Oct 10, 2011 3:32 pm

Kill them when they can and avoid them the rest of the time.

Blondshade · Post by **Blondshade** » Tue Oct 11, 2011 1:03 am

so do the lizardmen kill a lot of dark elves? Would they wipe us out if they all mobilize to attack or would we be fine?

what do you recommend for a cok name. how about death riders or slayers on rapters or something along those lines

Vulcan · Post by **Vulcan** » Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:25 pm

The DE Cold Ones are an odd lot, if compared to actual dinosaurs.

The arm proportions are definitely raptorish, as is the big sickle-claw on the feet. On the other side, their legs and tails are definitely too short for the raptor family, the lower legs should be about 50% longer and the tail about double the lenght. In that their proportions are much more like the tyrannosaurs.

The heads split the difference - too big for raptors, too small for tyrannosaurs. Maybe close to an allosaur?

Size is all wrong too. Obviously too small for most carnosuars, much too big for most raptors - including the Velociraptor which was about the size of a turkey. The only one that comes close is the Deinonychus, which is shorter at the shoulder and longer (primarily in the tail) overall.

Khel · Post by **Khel** » Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:34 pm

Blondshade wrote:so do the lizardmen kill a lot of dark elves? Would they wipe us out if they all mobilize to attack or would we be fine?

what do you recommend for a cok name. how about death riders or slayers on rapters or something along those lines

All I know there is that there is a somewhat bloody fued between the Lizardmen and Dark Elves. Probably because we are always stealing their ancient tomes and relic's of wonder and power for our own devilish ideals. I do remember somewhere however that there has been a time where Lizardmen had retaliated against the Dark Elves and attempted to "retrieve" the stolen artefacts. Whether this means they actually invaded through the south of Naggaroth (entirely possible but farfetched) or otherwise is a mysterious matter all together.

I have no idea of the numbers for Lizardmen but I doubt any army save Chaos could mount a successful campaign against Naggaroth and survive through the dreadful winters, not to mention fighting on Dark Elves home turf (not Ulthuan in this scenario).

Meteor · Post by **Meteor** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:01 am

And Ulthuan failed epicly when they tried to invade Naggaroth once. Lizards shouldn't have a problem surviving the winters though since they're cold blooded creatures themselves, but I don't know if they could invade successfully.

Anyway, about the whole raptor debate, if we take a look back at the previous set of Cold Ones, they look NOTHING like a raptor. Just a fattened, angry and scaly cow.

Only recently had they been redesigned and shaped into a more raptor like creature, and many of us dislike that agile look because it just doesn't spell out tough, slow, resilient S4 beasts that they're meant to be.

As far as names go, I'm very happy they're called Cold One Knights. It's intimidating, very suitable for Dark Elves, and as Tethlis has stated, it doesn't literally refer to the Cold Ones themselves (which are also called Nauglirs btw) but to the nature of the riders who have to poison themselves to confuse and allow said beasts to accept them as their own. Otherwise they could've named our knights Nauglir Riders instead, if they were literally referring to our beasts.

Raptor riders on the other hand, no way. It's not an intimidating name, and doesn't suit the theme of Dark Elf names. It sounds like something from Dinoriders back in the late 80s, and certainly makes me think more of Lizardmen than anything else.

p.s. The COK models from Gamezone, now that's a Nauglir. A little too lizard-like with the throat and head area, but it spells out tough, slow and bone crunching just like in the Malus books.

Post by **Drainial** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:15 am

It is being cold blooded that makes them so vulnerable; their blood is not heated internally but relies on the environment which obviously will be hard in Naggaroth. Not impossible given the Slaan and their magic but it would be a major problem. It is for this reason that snakes are found on every continent but not at the poles.

Also if you look at the models prior to the battle cows you will see that they were very raptor like indeed, these things change.

That said I do agree that Cold One Knights is a perfectly good name and there is no reason to change it.

Meteor · Post by **Meteor** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 2:19 am

Oh fail yes that is why lizards sun bathe all the time, to warm said cold blood.

Doug · Post by **Doug** » Fri Oct 28, 2011 1:44 am

I think that the Cold One Knight are aptly name. It desribes their mounts
and their hearts. My two cents.
Doug

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:03 am

To be fair, Druchii would probably just call them 'knights' (or their equivalent, anyway).

It wouldn't hurt if they had a better name, but the way GW names are trending, they would almost certainly become 'Hate Knights'

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:06 am

To be fair, Druchii would probably just call them 'knights' (or their equivalent, anyway).

It wouldn't hurt if they had a better name, but the way GW names are trending, they would almost certainly become 'Hate Knights'

Red... · Post by **Red...** » Fri Oct 28, 2011 8:54 am

Well, Dragon Princes is a societal label amongst High Elf culture. It denotes that they're from Caledor, and that they're Caledorian nobility, even though they don't literally ride dragons.

I actually think it should be the other way around. 'Cold One Knight' is a good term, because it is both impressive sounding and is literally accurate. It is a Knight, riding on a Cold One, end of story.

'Dragon Prince' is confusing. They are not princes, but merely nobles, and they don't ride dragons. Ok, sure, they are descended from the lines of Caledor etc etc, but even so, the name is just not a good fit.

'Silver helm' is a closer fit - they are knights who wear silver helms. But Dragon Princes? Nah, it's an odd one.

New Name for CoK's

New Name for CoK's

Re: New Name for CoK's