2250pts Combat Block List (Comped)

Get critiqued on your latest army here...

Moderator: The Dread Knights

Post Reply
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

2250pts Combat Block List (Comped)

Post by Skilgannon »

Hi Guys i'm thinking of a combat list with limited magic and some shooting to give me some ranged damage. What do you think?

Sorceress: L1, 2 Dispel Scrolls: 150pts
Death Hag: BSB, Cauldron: 225pts
Assassin: Additional Hand Weapon, Touch of Death, Rune of Khaine, Dark Venom: 161pts
Assassin: Additional Hand Weapon, Touch of Death, Rune of Khaine, Dark Venom: 161pts

21 Warriors: Champion, Standard, Musician, War banner: 166pts
21 Warriors: Champion, Standard, Musician, Banner of Cold Blood: 156pts
10 Repeater Crossbows: Shields, Musician: 115pts
10 Repeater Crossbows: Shields, Musician: 115pts
5 Harpies: 55pts
5 Harpies: 55pts

20 Black Guard: Champion, Standard, Musician, Ring of Hotek, Banner of Murder: 345pts
2 Cold One Chariots: 200pts
5 Cold One Knights: Musician: 143pts

2 Repeater Bolt Throwers: 200pts

2248pts

I'm reconing I have enough to get the blocks forward and into the face of some dangerous units. The quick stuff is then fairly free to hit the enemies other quick stuff and there is enough shooting to go after large targets or light units.
User avatar
Darius
Slave (off the Altar)
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:44 pm
Location: Newcastle

Post by Darius »

I would go for a Dreadlord to lead the army, as it is your general has to be the sorceress.

Also put in a magic weapon for those pesky etherials.
User avatar
Bounce
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1004
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:40 am

Post by Bounce »

I like it. The three blocks should be able to hold up against most foes and then the chariots can come in to smash the survivors.

With the assassins I would drop Dark Venom and just leave them with their normal poison, they are expensive enough already.

Also why the Banner of cold blood on the warriors? Do they really need a magic standard?

I wouldn't worry too much about ethereals. There are very very few of them around and even if you have a hero with magic weapon he is unlikely to get in combat with them
"I will embrace death without regret as I embrace life without fear"
ImageImageImage
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

@Darius
Those are two things I would quite like but I can't see how to fit them in. Both options would be quite expensive to fit in. Even getting Leadership 9 would be a big boost but I would have to lose something significant to achieve that.

@Bounce
I like to have a poision otherwise I get less chances at killing blow (which is essentially all they are there for). Also Double wounds in challenges is actually amazing well worth 10 points. It can completely turn around a combat.

The Cold Blood banner is partly there to make up for the lack of a Dreadlord/Ld 9 general. This gives me a better chance of charging all those fear causers passing panic checks/holding until I can counter charge. I don't want to be failing Leadership checks leaving my Assassin hitting on 6's.
User avatar
Bounce
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1004
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:40 am

Post by Bounce »

Killing blow is nice but theres a lot of stuff it doesn't work on. In these situations poison is fantastic. (Giants are a good example) Only 1/6 poisons would have been a killing blow anyway and now often 3/6 poisons won't even wound when previously they did.

Double wounds in challenge is nice but why would anyone accept a challenge from an assassin. Even if the character subsequently killed anyway it would be better than giving you so much free combat res.
"I will embrace death without regret as I embrace life without fear"
ImageImageImage
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

Most people accept with a champion to keep there character safe and fighting. Then you can kill the champion for lots of combat res negating the kills the character will have done on your unit.

Poision is handy but I wouldn't really want to use my assassin for that kind of work. I get what your saying though. But when I want Killing blow i'm probably going to need to have everything I can do to boost the chance of getting it.
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

NIce list for the Midland GT, just a few things, i would drop 1 assassin for a dreadlord, with ASF Dagger, and potion of strength, but it would mean shaving a few points, but i am not sure what to drop, but it is a nice list.
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

Good Plan Mitch,

Sorts out Darius' issues as well. I also realised that I had gone over my shooting limit (forgot the chariots) so I have had to put the RXBs into one unit, I also put a standard in there which along with stand and shoot makes them quite a nasty prospect.

Here is what it could look like:

Dreadlord: Ring of Hotek, Dagger of Hotek, Potion of Strength, Heavy Armour, Seadragon Cloak, Enchanted Shield: 247pts
Sorceress: L1, 2 Dispel Scrolls: 150pts
Death Hag: BSB, Cauldron: 225pts
Assassin: Additional Hand Weapon, Touch of Death, Rune of Khaine, Dark Venom: 161pts

21 Warriors: Champion, Standard, Musician, War banner: 166pts
21 Warriors: Champion, Standard, Musician: 141pts
18 Repeater Crossbows: Shields, Musician, Standard: 213pts
5 Harpies: 55pts
5 Harpies: 55pts

19 Black Guard: Standard, Musician, Banner of Murder: 293pts
2 Cold One Chariots: 200pts
5 Cold One Knights: Musician: 143pts

2 Repeater Bolt Throwers: 200pts

2249pts
Ozur
Trainee Warrior
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 8:37 pm

Post by Ozur »

I like the 2nd list more, but I'd give your Dreadlord a Dark Steed, so he can easily pop from unit to unit and always be where he's needed the most.

This way he also put some pressure on the enemy, as he can charge up to 18" out of his unit. I wouldn't solo charge with him in most cases though, since he's rather fragile on his own without a ward or regen save. But your enemy doesn't know this. He might think it's an unkillable dreadlord, ready to charge out as soon as he can.
7th W:22 D:5 L:4
8th W:4 D:1 L:0
The sea was angry that day my friends!
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

Cool, not sold on the bif RXBmen unit, great for killing Ben Johnsons, Daemons, not the famous one.

Personally i would use the points to get a small unit of shades with GWs in place of the extra crossbows.
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

I tell you what I need something to take him down he is owning me non stop at the minute.

I thought about the shades but I don't have any spare special slots available (two chariots, Knights and Black Guard). I admit i'm not convinced but it also helped me save some points to fit the Dreadlord in. I like having the shooting and i'm not sure what other option would be worthwhile given I only have core slots left.
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

I find chariots lack a bit with a cauldron army, great aginst some armies but i think skaven pretty much own chariots with the domwheel.

If you drop 1 chariot, as 1 is great against daemons and a few Crossbows you can get a unit of shades with GW's, for better synergy with the cauldron, then use the remainder points to get a champ with a magic weapon in the BG.

The dreadlord gives you some things your list needs, a magic weapon, ASF with some resilience.
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Darius
Slave (off the Altar)
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:44 pm
Location: Newcastle

Post by Darius »

Not sold on the Dreadlord set up Dagger of Hotek (ahw) and Enchanted shield, cant use both at the same time.

Id also put him on a dark steed or at a push a coldone.

Id also lose 1 chariot to get the shades.


P.S Ill be at the Midland GT also
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

@Darius

I see what your saying I wasn't sure if Dagger of Hotek was the additional hand weapon one. I might drop the shield then.

I'm getting a bit sick of taking mounted characters in infantry units to be honest it has always felt wrong. It would be nice to have an infantry hero for once so I think i might run with it but I agree that it wouldbe better if he was mounted.

Hopefully I will see you at Midlands.


@Mitch
I'm not worried about the chariots using the caulron there are plenty of other units which will get use out of it's blessings. Also I think Chariots are great against most things in the new books and are one of the best things in the book for getting rid of censor bearers which can be a real problem. Also by staying close to my blocks I think I can discourage the Doomwheel from coming close to the chariots. Double Chariot charges are definitely alot scarier than single chariot charges as well.

Also I want to keep the level of combat up in this army one of the things I like about it is it feels like a real combat force. Also I have struggled recently using shades so I might be best giving them a miss for a while.

Also it was great to chat to you at the GT. I hope the South Coast GT goes well it would be really disappointing not to see you at tournaments anymore.
User avatar
Babnik
Black Guard
Posts: 290
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2003 4:12 pm
Location: Paris, France

Post by Babnik »

Great list for close combat! But with a cauldron of blood, exec would be nice as they are stubborn...
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

I don't really see how Executioners would fit into this list well without ASF banner they aren't going to take a charge very well (even with Stubborn 8) and my Lord can't go in them if he wanted to. They just seem a very odd choice for this list.
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

Cool, good luck and it was nice meeting you at the final. I think i will keep going to events as i know a lot of people but i think i will be playing less and doing other things so i will be a bit rusty.

This is what i am toying with for midland.

Supreme Sorceress, Level 4, Sacrificial Dagger, Lifetaker, 2 Power Stones =355pts

Sorceress, 2 Dispel Scrolls, Level 2, Dark Pegasus =235pts
Death Hag, Cauldron of Blood, BSB, Dark Venom =235pts
Assassin, Rending Stars, Manbane, AHW =151pts

5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
20 Spears, Shields, FC =155pts
5 Harpies =55pts
5 Harpies =55pts

6 Cold One Knights, Standard, Banner of Murder, Champion, Null Talisman =234pts
7 Shades, GWs =126pts
7 Shades, GWs =126pts
Cold One Chariot =100pts

2 RBTs =200pts
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

That is good news at least.

Also I have ditched the Enchanted Shield on the Lord for a Black Guard Champion.

I like the list but I think you better check the comp again a couple issues I think I have spotted (so much comp these days all just slightly different, they could really have just agreed a pack together if they were going to be so similiar, it makes my head hurt).

Shooting limit: I think a RBT count as 5 of your shooting limit of 30 so you can only have 20 models with RXBs after that. (oddly this seems to be encouraging Hydras).

Assassin: I think they banned that assassin combo.

Magic: I think you are over again L4 + L2 + Sac Dagger + 2 POD = 9 Magic levels you can only have 8.

I think with a bit of tweaking you can fit your list in though. The comp is very harsh in some areas at Midlands (Hence my big unit of RXB).
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

Oh, so i will go back the original idea of a Executioner unit. I will tweak it and re submit later. Glad you like it. Should be interesting if we can both do better than the bad final we had.

Supreme Sorceress, Sacrificial Dagger, Lifetaker, 2 Power Stones =320pts

Sorceress, 2 Dispel Scrolls, Level 2, Dark Steed =197pts
Death Hag, Cauldron of Blood, =200pts
Death Hag, BSB, Touch of Death, Black Lotus, Standard of Hag Graef =200pts

5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
20 Spears, Shields, FC =155pts
5 Harpies =55pts
5 Harpies =55pts

6 Cold One Knights, Standard, Banner of Murder, Champion, Null Talisman =234pts
7 Shades, GWs =126pts
13 Executioners, FC =186pts
Cold One Chariot =100pts

2 RBTs =200pts


Amended list, to finally fit the comp
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Kheel
Noble
Posts: 437
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:04 am
Location: Sweden - without any polar bears!
Contact:

Post by Kheel »

I like your original list better than the new ones.

You don't really need power stone on our mages since Power of Darkness ( even if it goets dispelled ) let alone two...
In my experience, Death Hag BSBs with ASF, they are really effective with Witchbrew - we sometimes face opponents that mass us and flank everywhere - Witchbrew is sooo nice to have in those situations, and also if you have her in a unit with the AP banner it is a good idea to give her Rune of Khaine for the extra attacks.

I have never been a fan of shades, I know how to use them and that they can SOMETIMES be effective, but either they will be effective, or they won't do a darn thing - and to remove them for something that is obviously going to do something in every battle is more reliable, so I would swap them for another Chariot.




Before you change your list too much, because now we are faaar from where we originally started, take the original list out for playtesting, and then apply the changes afterwards and find out what works better, because if the original list is not broken, there is no need to "fix" it, if you know what I mean.
//Kheel

Nobody really cares if you’re miserable, so you might as well be happy.
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

I find shades in a shooting cap comped event worth their weight as they are more reliable and good for a little ducking and diving and with GWs and the cauldron situational punch unit.

I really would like to use witchbrew on the hag but i want to keep the killing blow synergy with the executioners. I am possibly tempted to get a small unit of Witchs in there for a more varied use of the Hag BSB.

I find chariots are god but i normally only use one so it might be worth it.

I will give the list a try out this friday and i will come back. Skil when are you looking to get some practice with your list??
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

Before you change your list too much, because now we are faaar from where we originally started, take the original list out for playtesting, and then apply the changes afterwards and find out what works better, because if the original list is not broken, there is no need to "fix" it, if you know what I mean.


Keel there are two diffferent people posting lists on this topic. (I wasn't sure if you were aware or not)

@ Mitch
Yeah I like the shades I too. I think you are still over the magic cap though. Why not put a power stone on the L2 and move a scroll over to the L4 in place of the sacrifical dagger that keeps you under comp but with bucket loads of extra power dice when you need them*. It also means you could use the spears for combat rather than power dice. :D I would also see if you can use the saved points to switch the mount to the L4 rather than the L2 it would help with Lifetaker and getting her out of harms way.

I like this list more. Have you thought about using the Manbane + Rune of Khaine on the Hag BSB especially with all the Skaven, Stegadons etc. these days it would give some extra flexibility since you can get alot of Killing Blow from the Executioners anyway.

I really like Witches but I like the set up you already have with your specials.

I am hoping to get some practice on Friday. I have a mersey practice game arranged and hopefully we will get a second game and I can try this one out. I have also entered it into a 1 dayer in oxford later this month so I should get a chance to give it a run out then as well.

*disclaimer - a very small bucket or very big dice
User avatar
Kheel
Noble
Posts: 437
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:04 am
Location: Sweden - without any polar bears!
Contact:

Post by Kheel »

Skilgannon wrote:
Keel there are two diffferent people posting lists on this topic. (I wasn't sure if you were aware or not)



I was not aware of that until you pointed it out. I thought that I was dealing with a schizo or something, but I guess it pays off to pay attention to the account names and not if there is a new army composition displayed...

sorry
//Kheel

Nobody really cares if you’re miserable, so you might as well be happy.
User avatar
Marauder mitch2
Malekith's Best Friend
Posts: 1575
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:48 am
Location: Menoth Wills it - Hippies or Goths

Post by Marauder mitch2 »

Supreme Sorceress, Level 4, Lifetaker, Power Stone, Scroll , Tome of Furion =350pts

Sorceress, Dispel Scroll, Level 2, Dark Steed =172pts
Death Hag, Cauldron of Blood, Dark Venom =210pts
Death Hag, BSB, Touch of Death, Black Lotus, Standard of Hag Graef =200pts

5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
5 Dark Riders, RXBs =110pts
20 Spears, Shields, Std, Champion, Musician =155pts
5 Harpies =55pts
5 Harpies =55pts
10 RXBmen, Shields =110pts

5 Cold One Knights =135pts
7 Shades, GWs =126pts
13 Executioners, FC =186pts
Cold One Chariot =100pts

Hydra =175pts

2249pts


Skil mate done some thinking, the hydra is too good not to have and teasking the knights so they give less vps and i can get 10 RXBmen to provide more shooting
DJ Dizzy Posted: Jul 1 2009, 08:13 PM


Horror


Group: Members
Posts: 15
Member No.: 1,989
Joined: 26-February 09



My daemon record is 2 wins and 12 losses... Yep, I suck at warhammer
User avatar
Skilgannon
Cold One Knight
Posts: 249
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:37 pm

Post by Skilgannon »

Yeah I definitely think with the way bolt throwers are treated towards the shooting cap the hydra is the way to go. I'm with you on the Cold Ones I have been take a beefer unit in my Mersey list and it hasn't been working for me (until this weekend that is, well hopefully. If my form has any chance of improving they will have to anyway). I really like the list for the level of comp in play you have plenty of shooting lots of magic and several decent combat units backed up by the cauldron. I think you list is probably as competitive as it comes.

Speaking of which I am going to the SCGT practice event (not the actual event unfortunately) and was thinking of trying to take as competitive a list as possible without a Dragon as opposed to my usual ranked infantry fetish and was wondering what you thought. I thought it might give some of the guys some relevant practice.

SC GT Comp 2250pts

Supreme Sorceress: L4, Dark Steed, Lifetaker, Tomb of Furion, Dispel Scroll: 348pts
Death Hag: BSB, Cauldron of Blood: 225pts
Sorceress: L2, Dispel Scroll: 160pts

Assassin: Additional hand Weapon, Rune of Khaine, Rending Stars: 151pts

10 RXB: Shields, Musician: 115pts
10 Warriors: Musician: 63pts
10 Warriors: Musician: 63pts
5 Harpies: 55pts
5 Harpies: 55pts

8 Shades: Additional hand weapons: 131pts
2 Cold one Chariots: 200pts
19 Black Guard: CSM, Banner of Murder: 307pts

2 Repeater Bolt Throwers: 200pts
Hydra: 175pts

2248pts
Post Reply